UFOs & JFK: He Knew Too Much! (Ft. Danny Sheehan)

I'm just a president. All of this is a side product of deception and duplicity. And to think that he [music] was alone taken completely by surprise by this nonsense. It's nonsense, man. It was all set up by the highest levels and they got away with it for 62 years. The National Archives a short time ago released thousands of new pages of declassified records related to President John F. Kennedy's

You have 80,000 documents that require a lot of, you know, artificial intelligence overlay, optical character recognition to make any sense of. Even then, I think very few people made any sense of them. I think they left more confused. There's a great great quote by Brett Weinstein where it's like looking through the JFK files is like looking for a needle in the hay stack where the needle is missing. And even President Trump when he was asked point blank who killed JFK after the file drop he said we released the files we did a historic thing or 80,000 pages of documents is a lot to

sit through. Can you just tell us who killed Kennedy? Well, you know, I was uh given the task of releasing that because many presidents have gone through it and they haven't released and I said release. We even released social security numbers. I didn't want anything deleted. They said, "Sir, what about social security But he kind of sidestepped the, you know, point blank question is who should be held culpable. And and and I don't think anybody has a good answer to that after that file release. I'm here with Jeremy Riss, alien scientist. Um, you've been making

epic videos for 20 years on not only UFOs and aliens, but often the science, the secret science behind all this stuff along with sprinkle in some of your favorite conspiracies. And uh it's uh I can't wait to speak to you, man. We've we've had some fun conversations. We don't agree on everything, but don't have to. We don't have to. That's the point of having conversations. And uh I'm excited to have you, man. Thank you for being For sure, man. Thanks for having me. It's great to finally be here. Absolutely. All right. Well, there's so

many jumping off points. There were just these JFK disclosures, right? Like what 80,000 do how many documents? Like a whole bunch. And then there, you know, how many how many things they didn't write down? You know, you got to think like you're planning to murder somebody. You don't write stuff down and keep a log and and a whole bunch of incriminating evidence on yourself. So, there's a lot of cool stuff in the documents that have come out so far. But, you know, really, you learn more uh from talking to long-term assassination researchers who have been way more I feel like people come out

came out of this way more confused than a lot of people did. Yeah. There's a lot of the the media used it as an opportunity to once again, you know, hype up this uh idea that, oh, there's nothing in the documents. There's nothing new here. This is all just conspiracy theories. You know, the typical Operation Mockingbird mantras and and whatnot. But uh yeah, the really the JFK research community has cracked this case and they've cracked it for you know numer number of years. I mean Jim Mars was one of the first with Crossfire. That was the book that Oliver

Stones JFK was based on and that really laid the foundation u for a lot of the investigations that followed. And there's been decades and decades and tons of people have dug into this from every possible angle. And now it's it's just come out that you know Priscilla McMillan who interviewed U Lee when he went to Russia and also befriended Marina Oswald and wrote her autobiography for her. Um she's a CIA agent. She's a witting CIA asset. And

that came out in one of the things that was revealed in the documents, which shows the level that they went through to get ahead of the sources and the story and be like, "All right, we're going to we're going to put our people in so that anyone getting information about this from the sources has to go through us basically." So, I know you to be uh you know, as deep on the topic as maybe anybody alive and you have a very coherent narrative. So, what do you think happened? Who who killed JFK? They actually the shot that was fired from the null that killed him was was

Morales. Uh David Morales and and he was called the Mexican. They're kind of different nicknames they had for him, but he was the crack shot uh out of the team, the S force team that had been put together to kill Fidel Castro. And it was a triangular uh fire team uh plan, you know, to have three gunmen crossfire at a moving target. That was the plan. That was the structure that they'd set up. And that they trained down in Waka, Mexico, you know, uh at the ranch of uh

occur? Well, well, what happened what happened is that the the the the people on the task force, the people that were recruited to be on the the esforce to kill Castro uh to in short, Castro and Cheera and the others that they were raid anti-communist uh Cubanos that had fled from Cuba in January of 1959 when Batista was overthrown. And they all fled up to Florida and camped out basically in

Miami and Tampa uh primarily. And they a lot of them were mafia gunmen that worked for Santos Trafocanti who was the dawn of the mafia uh in Havana and ran the gambling casinos, the houses of prostitution, but most importantly the heroin smuggling that was coming in from Southeast Asia because that was critical because the portion of the profits from the heroin sales that were going on through the mafia run by Santos Trafocanti in the

income was being used to purchase the explosives and weapons. There was a company set up uh with offices in Havana and in Miami that was the sea supply corporation they called it and on the face of it is sea. Oh, it's a sea supply corporation. Some kind of maritime thing. It was a Southeast Asian supply company run by Paul Helwell, the full-time central intelligence agency employee running the operation. Uh so he was getting the money to the

He was getting he was actually using the money from the heroin smuggling a portion of it to purchase the weapons and explosives here and then they would fly them from here. And that was that whole Terry and the pirates thing, what they call flying the hump that they they had this whole operation that a fellow named William D. Paulie uh was it worked for apprentice aviation and they were providing the airplanes and they were smuggling them in and flying them into China. Uh so there was a and you know uh Clare Booth Loose was involved in it. Uh

Henry Loose's wife. That's right. And it was in Dallas was involved. They were all involved in that. That's what they called the China lobby. That was that whole group that right from way back had figured that they were planning to really turn the the development operations of their economic investments into Asia and and Henry Loose then starts Life and Time magazine which publishes the Zaprruder film with the missing frames of the JFK assassination. That's right. So that's a very interesting connection as well which and as I as you know I mean I know

the guy that got the film Dick Billings. Yeah. Dick Billings and knew all about how they they brought it to Rochester and doctorred it. He he sat and told me about the whole thing. That's wild. So, he talks about them doctoring the film and and taking certain frames out and stuff. And did the frames involve David Morales and the other? It just it it uh it made it clear that he was being he was shot from the front. Okay. You could tell from that thing so that they reversed the actual uh frames of the of the film. And then

program because they asked him who ran the program. He said, "I don't know. I'll have to look and check for you." And he never got back. They never got back to that question. Never resolved that. Well, he's the one that ran the program. How do you not know who ran the program? You ran the program. And he lied about it to Congress and in front of and the whole entire of America. So, that one that one came out. That was a that was a huge one. Annslinger too that uh not Annsinger um Angleton, James Jesus Angleton and uh he was running this whole um spying program, the mail intercept program and this guy Ruben Efron was in

charge of that and um Ruben Efron is in the in the files and they ask him about do you know Ruben Efron and he says no that's a lie. You hired Ruben Efron and he ran the the spy program for you that was reading Lee Harvey Oswald's mail a and and and spying on this dude for years because he had a 2011 file into the CIA since 1959. So they were they have a massive file on Lee Harvey Oswald following all his actions. And to think that he was a lone nut and that we didn't know we had no idea and we were taken completely by surprise by this nonsense. It's

nonsense, man. It was all set up by the highest levels and they got away with it for 60 62 years. But it's it's I don't want it to be too confusing to everybody. It's it's easier kind of having in a chronological structure to understand how this thing happened because it's a that the entire operation was set up way back in 1960. You know, when uh when uh when when Fidel Castro and Chiga and the guys overthrew Batista and drove them out in January of 1959, Richard Nixon as the

vice president under Eisenhower and the chair of the 5412 committee, the supervised covert operations, he sent all kinds of communications to Fidel Castro saying, "Look, you are are fine. You've overthrown Batista, okay? It's a deal. what we want to do is make sure you don't have any diplomatic relations with China or Russia. You can't have," and he said, "you can't have any kind of relations with him at all." And Fidel Castro said, "Screw you. Who do you think you're talking to here?" You know, uh, and, you know, they they, you know, waved the old Monroe

Doctrine flag at him and so which he didn't give a crap about, you know, and and so Nixon got really poed with him. And so he then set up this covert operation, which was called originally operation 40. Mhm. Okay. And then he recruited, naturally enough, he recruited a whole bunch of uh a whole bunch of Batista supporters uh who supported the fascist authoritarian regime down there uh and worked directly with Santos Trafocanti because Santos Trafocanti was the business partner of Batista

and Paul in running the heroine operations and and it was just a means of covert funding for the operations to oppose China to oppose Maong. Mhm. This is amazing. Yeah. And and they didn't they didn't want to tell Congress about it at all because they didn't think they could muster enough support from Congress to actually support covert operations against Mount Zong. So, they did it totally covertly. They the CIA set up this entire operation to be supporting uh Chiang Kaishek uh in the so-called

nationalist forces. And the chief of security for for Chiang Kai-shek was the head of the green gang, the major heroin operation in in China. No way. Oh yeah. Whoa. Yeah. That is wild. Okay. So in 5960 time frame, you have the 5412 commission and committee rather. You have of which Nixon is ahead and he's sort of, you know, running kind of national security. He uh partners with uh mafia dons like

Well, actually actually he avoided that one by one step. What he did is recruited Howard Hughes. Yeah. He called Howard Hughes because Howard Hughes was a consultant to the 5412 committee. He would he had designed the Spruce Goose, which became the prototype for the C5A cargo plane that could fly, you know, major covert operations in and equipment and stuff. Uh, and he also he also designed the Glomar Explorer. Uh, that ship that could pick up Russian submarines off the bottom of the ocean

and stuff if they fell through. And a couple other extraordinarily sensitive programs that he was working on. Like what? Yeah, I can't tell you. I can't tell you that uh because of the way I know. You've said this before to me about Howard used and then I always go is it the UFO stuff? You go no no no it wasn't that. It was another what what else could be the so sensitive? Is it like time travel or No, no, no, no. Nothing esoteric like You're a man of the people, Danny. We need to know. As evidenced by Tim Dylan's recent and

masterful interview with CNN, legacy media can be a bit problematic. It's more sensationalist and divided than ever. They ask leading questions, brainwashed by their social muse. And that's why people are flocking to podcasts. But podcasts have their own limits. They're often 3 hours long. They're not super efficient. They aren't always factchecked. They're sort of a hybrid of entertainment and news. So, how do I stay informed amidst this backdrop? I started using my new favorite service, Ground News, a tool

designed for both skeptics and truth seekers like many in this community. Ground News is an app and website created by a former NASA engineer to tackle a problem we all face. How distorted the information is that we consume every day in the modern post-truth era. Ground News gathers coverage from over 50,000 sources worldwide, organizes the stories by topic, and even breaks down the bias and ownership behind each perspective so you know what you're getting. With features like the bias bar and factuality score,

it's easy to see how different outlets frame and spin the same story. When you eat certain foods, you want to see the ingredients list. This is the same thing, but for content and news. For example, when I was researching those mysterious drone sightings in New Jersey in December, Ground News gave me instant access to over 200 articles, helping me uncover every angle from the facts to the spin. Spoiler alert, I don't think they were just FAA approved research drones. So, if you're tired of echo chambers and one-sided narratives, ground news is your ultimate tool for staying informed and making better

news. The truth is out there. You just need the right tools to find it. It's it's one of those it's one of those kind of things that one of the very rare things that uh I I tend to agree that it would be good to tell people about it. You know, uh it would generate all kinds of damage and it wouldn't really benefit Got it. Uh it was the bottom line is but because of that he trusted uh Hughes and so he contacts him using the the the red

phone this the secure phone which he had from the 5412 committee communications called Howard Hughes and and Trafocanti told us all this. This all came directly from Trafocanti about how the whole thing happened. Uh and actually told us that the the day on which uh Richard Nixon called on the phone Howard Hughes was the day after uh Nelson Rockefeller withdrew from the 1960 Republican

presidential primary race. Against Nixon. Uh because as soon as he withdrew, Nixon knew he was going to be the nominee for the Republican party. in 1960 and he was sure he was going to win, right? So he then he then took upon himself the authority basically of the incoming president to contact Hughes and ask him to put together an assassination. What's the why did Rockefeller step down right then? I don't I don't quite He just withdrew. He he withdrew from the primary race for the Was that a coincidence or No. No. is. But what it did is it it it

freed up uh Nixon to realize he was going to be the nominee for the Republican party. And so he was therefore confident he was getting ready to be president. And so he started exercising the kind of a power that a president might do. And so he took onto himself this kind of authority to actually reach out and and have Howard Hughes set up an assassination team. Said, "But you got to keep it completely away from the White House. So you can't you just got to do it yourself." M and so what Howard Hughes did is sent for one of his lawyers that he had Bob

and had Mayhew he assigned Mayhew say here's the job the president kept they started referring to him as a president in their communications traffic said so oh my god they kept referring to him as a president they kept referring to him as the president know he was the VP yeah they said you know that he wants he wants this done he wants to keep it away from the white house and so so Bob Mayhew went to see because you know Howard Hughes was in Las Vegas he was hanging out at the Okay. Whether it was the whether it was the flamingo or the or the sands, one of the two. But anyway, he was up in the big penthouse

there and it was one of the mob hotels, right? And so he knew that they were there. And so Bob Mayhew went to see Johnny Roselli, who was the bagman, you know, for for uh uh the the mafia skim the skimming the cash off those casinos to be used, right? And so his principal, the guy in charge of him was Sam Gianana. out of Chicago. And so when Bob Mayu went to Johnny Roselli and said, "Look, you guys have your own reason for wanting to get rid of this Castro dude,

you know, shut down all your casinos, shut down your horouses." He said, uh, and very importantly, they've cut off the whole heroin supply. Okay? Uh, and so that you got your own reasons for wanting to get rid of him. So, you know, that the that Nixon is assuming that you'll do this for us. And so, uh, Johnny Roselli said, "Well, you know, I I don't have the authority to make a decision like that. We're going to have to talk to Sam Gianana." Uh, and so they went together, you know, Johnny Roselli and and Bob Mayhew went to Chicago and met with uh with Sam

Gianana uh and pitched the proposal to him. And Sam Gianana realized that, you know, doing a favor like this with the was going to get them a lot of potential goodwill, right? Uh and so and get and keep them keep the feds off their back. So he was agreeing in principle to do it. He said, "But you know, but this isn't up to me. That's Santos Trafocanti's territory. That's down in Havana. He's the Bob boss in Havana. He's even though he's up in Tampa now cuz he he left Cuba. They said, "So we

have to go talk to him." So they they went down they went down to see him. Now they were down there about September or so. This all started around June around June 7th. Mhm. It was when was when uh Rockefeller June 7th of 1960. So between then it was now early September Johnny Roselli, Bob Mayhew uh and and Sam Gianana went down to to Florida to and at the Fontan Blue Hotel uh met with uh met with Trafocanti and

they had two set two meetings uh in which finally Trafocanti tells us that he said you know I agreed in principle to do this. He said, "But I I wanted to make sure that, you know, he said it wasn't some kind of brain fart." He said, "You know, on the part of uh of Bob Mayhew or even Howard Hughes wanted to make certain that this was coming from the president." That's what he that's how he termed it. He said, and so that they had a third meeting uh and a guy another guy comes to the meeting at the at the Font Blue Hotel using the

he had down there uh that were enforcers who had fled with him to to Florida in January of 59 and had had gotten recruited by by Richard Nixon and the CIA to run covert operations against Cuba because when when Fidel Castro just finally thumbmed his nose at at uh at Nixon and said, you know, screw you. I'm I'm going to have relations with anybody I want. So, I'll have diplomatic relations with Russia and China, you know, therefore quote violating the

Monroe Doctrine, you know, of allowing a foreign power to start having influence inside our hemisphere, you know, or our zone of influence. Uh and so so what happened is Richard Nixon had mounted this covert operation and he'd recruited all of these people that were Travocanti gunmen in in mobsters basically but virulent you know and were all into in around Miami. They had the 25506 brigade. They had Alpha 66. There were a bunch of

these kind of uh well, it's unfair to call them covens, but I mean, but they were they were these uh these uh gangs like that were there that were engaged in covert operations. And so they thought that they were kind of invested with kind of a certain kind of authority on the part of the federal government because they're paid by the CIA to do this. And they set up these these bases. They set one up on Noame Key. They set one up on Swan Island. They put one in the Everglades. Then they had two

of them at Lake Pont Train over in Louisiana. One on the southern uh coast of the of Lake Pon Train, one on the northern coast. And they set up these these paramilitary bases in these rapidly anti-communist pro-batista, you know, Trafocanti gunmen. A lot of them, you know, were covert operators working under the opice of the CIA to run these covert operations. So Trafocani says, "Okay, Nixon wants me to put together this assassination team. I'm going to take my

who are working with the CIA, but in a completely different capacity just to run covert operations. What I'm going to do is recruit 15 of them. Uh I'll handpick them and we'll put them into this special S force they call it." And uh that's what they did. And they would send private planes to go pick them up, you know, at these five different paramilitary bases. They would pick up a couple of the guys at each one and they would fly them to Fort Wuka in Arizona. Uh and big electronic uh

surveillance operations that they've got going there, Fort Wuka. Uh, and so they'd bring them there and then they would sign in and then they would just off the records and then they were flown down to Waka, Mexico to the ranch of Clint Merchesen Jr., very wealthy uh ski of the this uh oil fortune uh down there who his father his father owned the Dallas Texans football team, you know, Cowboys. Yeah. Well, later Cowboys. It was Texans

at the time. Okay. Interesting. That's that's who they were and you know horse racing and rich people and something and so they had this big ranch down in Waka. So they set up a triangular fire team base down there to to practice shooting a moving target from three different locations to get a triangular crossfire onto the site uh onto the target uh and they were training them and Carl Jenkins was uh was brought in uh from the CIA to train them on this under ZR rifle. It

was the code name for the program, but they this was a whole separate thing and it was not even known to many people at all that this was going on because they were trying to keep it away from the White House. So that operation is going on and the way they funded it was from the skim of money off the casinos. Uh and they would skim the money off the casinos. They would uh put the the cash into these brand new big expensive suitcases and put them in the trunk of brand new Cadillac automobiles and they would drive them and I know the guy that

sold them the the Cadillacs cuz he had the big dealership there. In Vegas anyway. And anyway, then I interviewed him at length about it, you know. And so that they drive the cars uh through uh New Orleans uh in Marcelo was there and they did the audit on all the all the money to keep track of how much money they were moving and then they would repack it and they would drive them into Florida, deposit it in the Miami National Bank of Uh and then they would wire a portion of

the money down into the Banko International uh down in Mexico City. uh and they put it into this account by uh this lawyer by name of Vulgario had the account down in the bank uh and then they would pay the costs for the whole triangular fire team training base down in in Moaka and and that's the So how do you go from this systematic drug covert operation that ultimately is in support of the resistance in China

the Guing and the you know uh Chiang Kai-shek how do you go from at um and then this plan initially to take out you know Shabbar and Castro who are you know uh impinging upon the Monroe doctrine to killing JFK sitting president. What what happened is that that that whole operation was going when suddenly Richard Nixon didn't get elected. John F. Kennedy of the state of Massachusetts has received for president of the United States 303 votes. Richard

M. Nixon of the state of California has received 219 votes. This is the first time in 100 years that a candidate for the presidency in which he was defeated and announced the victory of his opponent. All of you work in a cause that is bigger than any man's ambition, greater than any party.

It is the cause of freedom, of justice, and peace for all mankind. And it is in that spirit that I now declare that John F. Kennedy has been elected president of the United States and Lyndon Johnson, vice president of the United States. they brief Kennedy now about the Bay of Pigs plan that they had going, but they didn't tell him about the assassination

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And so they lure him into the to allowing the the invasion to go on, the attempted invasion at the Bay of Pigs. But he tells them right from the very beginning that he won't provide air cover. He won't provide any air cover and he won't he won't provide any kind of US military intervention. You know, they wanted to be able to land on the beach and basically raise the flag of free of free Cuba and then ask for US intervention and do it the oldfashioned way. Yeah. You know, just send in a paramilitary operation. And Kennedy wouldn't do it. Uh and they said, "Oh,"

he said, "look at if you're telling me that the people of Cuba want to rise up against Castro because they're so unhappy with him. Yeah. If they land on the beach and they raise the flag of a free Cuba, if the people all rally and and toss out Castro, good. If you're telling me the truth that they're going to do it, you go ahead and do it." Yeah. And [clears throat] what happened is they had two or three, you know, B-25s or these old bomber planes that were down in Nicaragua actually uh that uh that uh uh the uh Samosa

Anastasio Samosa was uh was supporting them in doing this, you know, was this kind of right-wing fascist dude. And so the bottom line is that they were going to provide their own air cover for this. And what happened is they were in a different time zone. Mhm. And so they got there an hour late after the landing. Uh and the guys had been knifed whacked already. They sank their ammunition boat and everything, you know. Uh so they were trapped on the beach and they all got arrested and uh and the whole thing fell through.

Wednesday, April 19th, resistance ends. All those who are not killed are taken Uh and then then Kennedy took responsibility for it. And this is where the thing starts. Kennedy took responsibility for it. Uh, and the the Cubano guys that got all arrested were upset at him for refusing not only to provide air support, but they had, you know, that uh in in fact uh uh General Curtis Lameé and other folks in the joint chiefs had

actually moved US military forces into place. They they put naval ships with Marines in them. you know, sta staged them contrary to the orders of the president, you know, ordered in the There was so much at the time that Curtis Lame felt the liberty to to do by himself. Like he he put apparently, I didn't even know this during the Cuban missile crisis later, obviously, he put uh us into Defcon 2 without the president's permission. He did. It's crazy. He did uh and and launched

and gave him gave Cruchef Kennedy did his solemn promise that he would cease and desist from efforts to to undermine the government in in Cuba. Uh and he went down to Cuba. He went down to Miami at the Orange Bowl actually and convened, you know, a whole meeting of all these kind of right-wing Cubano refugees that had fled from there in the whole stadium. and he apologized to them all in person and said that he gave them his personal guarantee that the free flag of Cuba would be flying over the

island by the end of his second term. And he said that to them, I can assure you that this flag will be returned to this brigade in a free event. And then he turned around and had lied to to to uh to uh Kruef and actually converted operation 40 into operation mongoose. It's all it did. It set up the

big operation on the uh Miami University of Miami campus called JM Wave. This great big gigantic airplane set of hangers and they had all the operations going on there. It was a full-scale war operation going on against Cuba. And so he continued doing that. And so so uh cruise shaft said screw you then and started moving missiles in and and so all all this was happening all right in that first that first period from 1961. He's elected in November of 1960 comes into office in January of 1961. You know

he does all this apologizing and stuff uh because it was in April of ' 61 that the the Bay of Pigs thing came down. Uh, and so he apologizes, but he's totally pissed off, you know, at the CIA for bungling this whole operation. Uh, and the the days of Alan Dulles were And so he waited all the way till the fall, September, October, you know, of uh of 60 61 uh and then pushed Dulles out.

But Dulles didn't leave. He didn't leave Washington. He had his whole setup over in Georgetown in his his big brownstone over there and all the guys from the CIA were going over to meet with him like every day. He had like a social club, wasn't it called the Georgetown set? Do you know what I'm talking about? Yeah, I they they Georgetown's a very We won't get too far. It's a very interesting place, you know, with every administration. You've got these very wealthy uh social

I've been in a bunch of them. Yeah. You know, and and again recently, the new administration has got people over Yeah. Yeah. I remember being in Michael Pillsbury's house, which I think was JFK's old In uh Georgetown. Yeah. And uh just being like, "This is amazing. So cool." I mean, he's the been a kind of lead China expert in every administration since Nixon. Yeah. And uh it's a very elite group over there. So, so the bottom line is that that that

that so the whole operation shifts over to Operation Mongoose being run out of JM Wave uh and and and cruise chef starts sending the missiles in to Cuba. Uh and then they discover that the missiles in there. The whole Cuban missile crisis comes down, right? Within the past week, unmistakable evidence has established the fact that a series of offensive missile sites is now in preparation on that imprisoned island goes all the way through uh into the

into late October, right? And then this this bizarre thing happens with the UFO, right? uh that uh that and and we'll just set that aside for a moment because because it's it's a very kind of comparatively new piece of information. But the bottom line is that by the time they get to October 26th, the night of October 26th, they come to within like 2 uh this whole thing with with uh with uh uh General Curtis Lame trying to

they came to the nuclear war. This is where it starts now. And what happened is he reached back out to to Kruef. Said, "Okay, you're right. I lied to you. You know, we we you're right. We kept on doing the operation mongoose, you know, but you shouldn't have put the missiles in there. Uh we're going to make a deal, you know, that I'll take the missiles out of Turkey. You take the missiles out of here. Uh and he ordered the all of those those uh bases, those paramilitary bases to cease and desist

from any further operations. But but he didn't know about the assassination team that had been deployed that uh but he ordered this shutting down of all the bases. And what happens is in December December of uh of 1962, who is the CIA leazison to the Kubano uh guys, uh out on uh Noame Key,

uh uh he he decides he's going to even after getting the orders from the president that they're all to stand down and to discontin continue their operations. He in complete defiance with the with the Cubans launches an assault into Cuba and sinks a Russian ship. Whoa. Which like nobody knows about, you know, that anymore. But they they sank a Russian ship. When was this? This December of 1962. Uh sinks a Russian ship. Kennedy freaks out over the fact that,

arrest all those guys including Sturgis and charge them with a violation of the neutrality act mounting military operations against a country with whom we have diplomatic relations. Right. Uh and hold them for almost a week and then let him go. Okay. But it's kind of shot across the bow. The president's serious. They gze in on it. You know, you're not going to do this anymore. Then a second group, the ones in the Everglades, the under the leazison of E Howard Hunt. Start planning another attack into Cuba

in complete defiance of the president even after the what they had done over on on the name key. And so Bobby and John send in the same six helicopter gunships and burn them out too and arrest them and charge them with the Neutrality Act violations. uh and the heads of the the 50 the the uh the 25506 brigade in Alpha 66 resolve they're going to kill these guys. They're going to kill John and Bobby who are complete traitors that they've lied to them. They

came he came down and promised they were going to going to support them and overthrowing the government. Now they're chickening out and they're they're they want to kill him. uh but they know that they can't get away with it, you know, but they've got the S force that's capable of doing something like that. So, they're all kind of, you know, just pawing away like a charging bull wanting to get at the president and kill him and the attorney general both, you know, and uh but they can't get away with this. And so what happens is Kennedy turns out

forces can get out of control and the the nuclear weapons that threat the total annihilation of our whole human species. So they can't let this happen. So what they do is they start discussing how they're going to order each of them is going to exercise their respective executive authority to start ordering the disassembly of the nuclear warheads in their respective arsenals and destroy Not just take them and put them on a shelf somewhere where they can just screw them back on in another week or so, you know, but destroy them. And they

they reached this agreement in So he was JFK was really going for it. He was trying to denuclearize entirely. Totally going for it. And there's a there's this book um I think called Mary's Mosaic. Oh yeah. About you know Mary Pinchin. Yeah. Mary Pinchin who is the wife of uh Cord Meer. Meer Cord Meyer you know World War II veteran who I believe came back with a I think an eye patch and uh you know he turned him into a pacifist and then he sort of got in with the Dulles Allan Dulles kind of intel cabal. Yeah. and became this

kind of wararmonger who I think believe later was in charge of operation mockingb bird so like incepting kind of journalism world with with intel assets. Um but also uh was became this kind kind of bloodthirsty guy and so his uh wife uh married Mary Vision Meyer she was murdered. She was an artist and she was kind of a little more kind of spiritual hippie- dippy and she LSD stuff L. So yeah, so she had an affair with but more even more than that. I mean it

was it was a prolonged relationship. She she became in a certain sense his actual sort of and they did LSD together. And I provided by provided by Tim Liry. That's wild. Provided by Timothy Larry. Timothy provided it to him. I know the guy that that knows. Of course you did. Um, yeah. Okay. Um, are you still lugging around one of those bulky worn out wallets? You know, I am. Your posture is not great due to that

Are you aware of that? I'm I'm currently now more self-aware of my posture. It might be time for an upgrade. Oh, what do you suggest? My personal suggestion is Ridge Wallet. Look at this sleek design. Do you see Oh, wow. So sleek. Yeah, pretty sleek. Uh-huh. This thing holds up to 12 cards plus cash. All in a slim, durable, and stylish package, too. You took the words right out of my Ridge wallets feature RFID blocking

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Just head to ridge.com/cosmic to see their biggest sale of the year. After you purchase, they will ask about where you heard about them. Where did they hear about Ridge Wallet, Chris? Um, they heard it here first on American Please support our show and tell them our show sent you. Upgrade your wallet. Thank me later. And then I think they do LSD together, JFK and Mary Meyer. And and this is sort of rumor mill stuff. So I'm curious to

get your take after that. JFK because she has this mission of like I need to like stop these guy like her her husband Gordon Meyer and all of his associates are gonna like blow up the world. Yeah. And she is like we need to reign these guys in. And she does LSD with JFK. And then JFK kind of he was already more pacifist than them. But he he he becomes more hardcore like we really need to kind of He saw the light, you know, and he he went through this metaninoia as we refer to it. this

metaninoia experience about how incredible this was, you know, and and how extraordinarily outrageous, you know, uh, uh, Curtis Lameé and the joint chiefs have been, you know, and they'd already proposed to him this Operation Northwoods, you know, of, oh, okay, because they were so desperate wanting to get Castro out of there that they were so dedicated in their mission to preserve US complete domination and control of the whole Western Hemisphere that they viewed this as an absolute horrible affront. to have these guys in Cuba. So they were just

were working on trying to get this done. So he dies in early June. And what Kennedy decides is that in order to to make up for the massive dysfunding of the whole nuclear weapons programs in both countries that in order to have a massive economic stimulus to replace that that he wants to and he proposes to to Gorbachev that uh or to Kruef that that they have a joint Soviet US space program that they completely combine their forces and they they overcome the

know about this other thing. Yeah. The Harold Mgrren stuff. Yeah that's right. Yeah. So yeah he he asked to get briefed about uh you know UFOs and wants to know more and and this is really an important fact. John McCone before he became director of CIA after Dulles departed was also the uh lead of the atomic energy commission. He ran the atomic energy commission. So he definitely have been privy to all of the secrets when it came to UFOs given the nuclear And so he's asking for that and then I

can I can give you the little Malgrren piece which is so Malgrren Harold Malgrren was presidential adviser for JFK. He was the youngest of presidential adviserss. He was one of McNamera's whiz kids and McNamera's you know secretary of defense at the time. Malmrren is 27 years old and he's in the situation room around the Cuban missile crisis. And at that same time, the Cuban missile crisis, Magnamera had put him in charge of cost assessments for these new X-raybased missile defense systems. And

so they're doing these tests in the Marshall Islands, specifically at Johnston Atoll. And you have this these test series called um you know uh Starfish Prime tests. And uh one of the tests is is the Bluegill series. And this is this kind of X-ray projection in the nose cone of these ICBMs meant to take out incoming nuclear warheads which we didn't have great nuclear defense at the time. Yeah. And so this was this really exciting experimental thing. And the Rand Corporation had a paper on it actually

And so Harold is in charge of doing all the cost assessing for this. and uh he catches wind that in this test a UFO gets knocked out of the comes out of the plume of the nuclear blast and he freaks out and he says well I need to know about this and they used to call them tagalongs at the time because they were so kind of you know immune to or was so casual and you know cold war kind of intensity was so uh you know I don't know it kind of uh

kind of past crash retrievals, including Magenta of 1933. And so Malgrren knows about this stuff. And then JFK, I think a couple weeks later, a few weeks later, ends up at Los Alamos getting briefed. getting. Yeah. So, it's like, is that a coincidence? Probably not. Well, what it is is that then Kennedy realizes that if if he can give this to Cruchef, that'll seal the deal that

Cruchef will know that he's completely he's dropping this kind of nationalistic competitive thing with with Russia. Uh, and that they can have a a genuine joint space program. And of course, they need to know about what this extraterrestrial dimension is if they're going to be venturing out into space together. [clears throat] So he So, but what happens is when he demands the briefing from Mcome, the Bissell and the other guys tell uh tell Dulles about it. Because Bissell and in and Angleton and the other guys kept going over to see

Dallasos all the time. Yeah. In the Brownstone over in Georgetown because he never left town. He just stayed right there because the fact of the matter is is that the reason he'd been appointed to be the first civilian director of the CIA is the fact that he was legal counsel for Brown Brothers Haramman. This is Dulles. That's Dulles. Alan Dulles. And that's where the China lobby is. That's the group of people that had decided long ago that what they would do is secretly fund the rise of Hitler in Germany after

World War I through the Union Bank to to the Union Bank and all that stuff that they set up to have them be raised up to be the bull work against bullsheism in Europe. Yeah. And since the the investors at Brown Brothers Haramman, these two dozen and that was the initial feeder for the CIA came out of the Brown Brothers. That's right. It was it was Robert Love it who actually wrote the initial memo to Truman saying we've got to we've got to reinstitute a a major agency like the OSS. We got to have it in peace time. Uh and it came from Robert Levven, senior

partner at Brown Brothers Haramman. And so that that whole group was where was the seat of the China lobby who saw the future of investment you know capital investment in the Asian markets because they already owned a controlling stock interest in most of the war industry in Germany which they'd extracted through the Verasai treaty agreement long involved in process they did it but the bottom line is that when at the at the end of World War I at the end of World War one uh when the

treaty of Versailles was being signed, Robert Lancing who was the Secretary of State under Dulles's uncle was the uncle of Allen and John Foster Dulles. He had married the eldest daughter of John W. Foster who was the maternal grandfather for both Allen and and and John uh that uh uh John Foster. So there was John W. Foster was the the guy and he was an arch imperialist.

He's the guy that overthrew under his when he was secretary of state, he overthrew the island of Hawaii and started taking Guam and that whole thing focusing on moving into Asia. Wow. That was the whole idea of that. And so that what they did in the Verasai treaty, he got Robert Lancing who was the son-in-law of John W. Foster had had Robert Lancing, his son-in-law, bring his two grandsons, John Foster Delos and Alan Delos, with him to the Versai treaty

and actually as lawyers at Sullivan and Cromwell that to draft into the into the Verasai treaty agreement the war reparations requirements that Germany had to had to pay war reparations for all the damage they'd inflicted on other industries. So that made them dependent on the Union Well, well, what happened? happened was this is even pre-UN bank. This is in 1918. And so what they did is they they said look that you're going to have to pay these war reparations. They imposed that that financial obligation on them,

but they didn't have the money to pay them. And so what happened is the investors in Brown Brothers Haramman, these 20 24, you know, robber baron families, you know, the Rockefellers and and the and and Haramman railway people and Carnegie and all of these guys. Yeah. Melons, all of them were there. uh and they saw their future as going uh westward into Asia because what they could do is they could secure control over Europe through Germany. Uh and and what they would do is they would loan the money

to Germany to pay the war reparations and they would take as security for their loans the controlling stock interest in like the corrupt ball bearing factory and and IG Farbin and all these other major war industries making the explosives and chemicals. They would they would have this a lot of these were kind of operation paperclip based companies, right? Like they were they were in some cases started and run by Nazis, right? Well, the Nazis weren't there really yet. This is only 1918. Okay. Right. And

but so so what happened is what what they did is is they set up that mechanism by means of which the stockholders or the investors in Brown Brothers Heramman from these two dozen wealthy superw wealthy families. What they did is they had the controlling stock interest in those companies and then what they did is they additionally loaned additional money to Germany to rebuild their war machine so that they could be the bull work against boleeism because at the very end of the of the the first world war in October of 1917 the bolevixs had

overthrown Zar Nicholas II and overthrown him and withdrawn them from from World War I. And so what happened is this this this seat of kind of a socialist alternative to the kind of investment ideas that were housed at Brown Brothers Aramman that they viewed them as this terrible adversary. So what they did is they leaned in on Robert Lancing who was the secretary of state and sent a foreign military expedition into Russia that almost nobody knows about it. Now

the a full-scale US financed US military foreign expeditionary force into Russia to try in 1918. Wow. To try to crush the Bolevik revolution. Wow. Really? And they recruited the white Russians. All those kind of Tsarist Russians that were in St. Petersburg. That whole Was Dulles involved in that that Dulles Dulles was involved with Germany? uh he was he was appointed to be the legal counsel for Germany uh as well as the leg legal counsel for

Brown brothers Haramman. So he was he was negotiating both sides of these these financial agreements so that they they had them owning the he was the legal counsel for Brown brothers Haramman but for Germany is what what he was appointed by Robert Lancing his uncle to be the legal counsel for Germany as well so that he was on both sides of the negotiations. He was counseling Germany to accept these loans. Wow. You know, and and to rebuild their their war industry. Uh and he he ended up being the the basically almost the legal

governor general, you know, working for the German government. Wow. Uh and so that that that's what he did. He choreographed that entire thing. And so what happened is they got that all set up in 18 1918 1919. Yeah. Then they then Robert Lancing sent the foreign military expeditionary force. into Russia to try to crush the the Bolevik revolution in the cradle. Hey everyone, Jesse here. Let's talk about something a lot of us quietly deal with. Hair loss. This is something that messes with your confidence more than

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support our show and tell them we sent you. Hair loss is frustrating. You don't have to fight it alone. Thanks to Iristo. But let's let's get back to Okay, so 63. So he's aware he's aware of UFOs and trying to do some joint space program with Kruev around that. Yes. He is trying to defang the American nuclear arsenal, but also have Soviets. Yeah. Duclearize entirely mutual And uh he is trying to take the country back, the US back from this kind of China agreed. China agreed that they

would not pursue any nuclear program at Do we have records of that or Yes. Oh, yeah. Oh, yes. Where are the records of that? That uh there's they can dig them out because they they he reached out they reached out to China. China only had he reached out to M. They had a real early uh interest in kind of trying to deal with the nuclear weapons issue, but they hadn't really mounted a program and and he agreed to forestall the entire really. Mhm. So at that at that point at

that point in between basically January of of 1963 and June of 1963 at least prior to when when John the 23rd died that that was still a kind of totally viable operation that they were planning to do. Uh and then when when John the 23rd died, I think uh Kennedy leaned forward into it to try to to try to make sure that the thing kept on going. And so he decided he was going to get the information for Kruef and give it to him

as a further sign of good faith so that they could not only uh have a complete open and honest relationship by putting some skin in the game by coughing up the information we had about this but also prepare for the who they were going to be encountering, you know, out in in an extraterrestrial you know. And what happened is uh uh on June 5th when he asked for it, the Bissell, it's almost certain it was Bissell, you know, found out about it,

you know, and told Dulles. And so Dulles and the guys started really wait they can't allow the nuclear missiles to be disassembled because they have to have them to deal with China, you know, because China had demonstrated already in the Kore in Korea that they could put a billion men in uniform and just melt your bar gun barrels down by just pouring them on you like they did up at Inchan and at the reservoir. You know that that's what they did. They just sent in like a billion guys, you

know, and just stormed them. Uh, and so they realized that they could not take on China in the future in a traditional land war. So they needed the nuclear weapons. That's why MacArthur kept saying what we got to do is show them bomb them. You know, that whole thing that that fallout with Truman. So So the bottom line is that China lobby freaked out about potentially losing their nuclear option against China. So that can't be that we can't allow that to happen and we can't wait a year for the elections, you know. I mean, you know,

they can probably figure out how to get rid of him in the election. You know, uh but they couldn't wait the year cuz he would order start ordering the disassembly. And so what happened is that uh when he when on uh that June 5th that uh he ended up uh issuing the uh the the demand for the he did the same thing same day he did this weird thing which I've never been to quite figure out yet about the printing these uh these silver certificates.

He did that on June 5th too. Interesting. He did a whole bunch of these things. I I met Oliver Stone once and he connects the printing of the silver certificates with JFK's assassination. Like that was somehow undermining of well he was he was doing a lot of radical things right there. You think that what happened was when when John the 23rd died, you know, Kennedy uh he was hoping to to bring John the 23rd in and kind of Catholic support for what he was doing.

uh the ethics of what he was doing, the whole speech at at George Washington University and all that stuff, you know, he was going through this real metaninoia at that time, you know, and uh but the the act of of disassembling and destroying the nuclear warheads was viewed by Dulles and the guys as a as an act of treason, you know. Uh, and not only that, but it was eliminating their ability to actually quell China, you know, and to to be able to have access to the market,

the Asian market. So, what he did is just greenlighted the S force. So, this is this kind of sleeper cell. Yeah. They're just select group of trafficante Cuban exiles who are these kind of killer assassins that were originally commissioned to uh take out Shabbar and Castro and he reoperationalizes them to take out JFK just all he had to do is just get up off their neck. So who were the three who were the the two men on the grassy null? Who were

these guys. And then you look at the what's come out about um Oswald's land She's a super curious character. She's still alive, bro. She's like 93. No way. Ruth Payne is her name. Ruth Payne. That's right. And she somehow was connected with Dulles's mistress Bankraftoft. Am I making that Yeah. No, this is correct. Um, she actually vacationed the summer of 1963 at a place called Nashon Island, which is right up near Martha's Vineyard in

And Nan Island is owned by the Forbes family. That's John Kerry Forbes, the guy who ran against Bush in 2004. Yeah. Right. They were both Skull and Bones. They both went to Yale Secret society. Um, the Forbes family hosted this summer retreat at their mansion. Ruth Paynees there with Alan Dulles, Alan Dulles's mistress. Mhm. What they discussed is again that's not going to be in the JFK files. It's not going to be in the Kennedy. What year were they together there? That's so right there. So right after she leaves Nan Island,

she she I I think she either before she went to Nan or after she visits her sister in Virginia. Turns out her sister works for the CIA. That's that's come Then she goes picks up Lee and Marina in New Orleans and brings them to Dallas. Gives them a home. hooks Lee up with this job at the Schoolbook Depository Building, which by the way, the Schoolbook Depository Building is an interesting It's owned by D. Harold Bird. DryHole Bird is uh David Harold Bird is his real name, but they call him

Dryhole Bird because he was against something called the oil depletion allowance. He's a oil oil man. And uh Kennedy wanted to get rid of this oil depletion allowance, which would have made all the oil people have to basically pay a ton of money. They wouldn't get this government tax break for Uncle Sam. So they were all they all hated county. They wanted him gone for that reason. That's where you have the the oil big oil element and big oil goes back way long in history. There's a whole book by Daniel Jurgen called the prize and there's a prize part two where he talks about the whole history of oil with John D. Rockefeller and how he

bought out all the railroads and and would only ship his oil through the railroads so he could basically have a monopoly over the oil business cuz none of the other oil companies could ship their oil cuz he owned all the railroads. That's why you, you know, in Monopoly, you own all the railroads. It's it's part of the game. And um again, he he shut all the business and competition out and uh they were eventually dis disbanded with the antirust act um that, you know, broke up all the monopolies supposedly. But um a lot of these oil people have a real

dangerous history of murder and conspiracy going way back to then, you know, and just doing terrible things. Uh so yeah, those guys are involved. And then D Herald Bird, in addition to being an oil man, he's also um buys a bunch of stock in this company called LTV, Ling Temco VA. And he's part of he owns this big share in in VA Aerospace. Well, it turns out VA Aerospace built all the flying saucers for Wright Patterson in the 40s and 50s under a guy named Alfred C. Loading. Wait, wait, what?

Really? We built What do you mean? When you say built the flying saucers, like built the Averro car project, which is on record? Well, the Aro car project was Canada. So that was that that's but then it got moved to right Pat as project Y bug. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. But but like so what when you say built flying saucers because so the VA flying pancake is a is a VA aircraft and it's a it's literally attempt it's early attempt to build a a flying saucer with propellers. That was before Avro car in the 40s. It was way before this was ear this was even predates. That's so interesting. I didn't I didn't

even heard of this. That's so wow. It's it's it's it's very obscure. It's not well known. And then T LTV, Ling Tenko Vought. Um he Ling, he gives a bunch of money with Ling and they invest in this right before the Kennedy assassination. And of course aerospace and and all those people made a ton of money off the Kennedy assassination. And then you have deep space aerospace uh connections, deep state aerospace connections to uh Lee Harvey Oswald because he worked at Atsugi, which is where the CIA was running the U2 spy

plane program, you know. So, well, also I believe Harold Bird, who owned the Texas Book Depository, um he was I think had some connections with LBJ and then he was also connected with Curtis Lame. Curtis Lame gave him an award for the Civil Airore when he was younger. Yes. And Curtis Lay hated JFK and uh you know thought that he was you know kind of a traitor back and there's pictures of LBJ and DH Harold Bird together like going to football games and and and they were

they were good friends so they definitely knew each other definitely um maybe the craziest thing of all I mean J JFK we're painting a picture of him just being 360 surrounded by these like you know spooky people. Um the mayor of Dallas was a guy named Earl Cabel. Yeah. And um his his brother Charles was Dallas's number two at the CIA on the Bay of Pigs. There you go. And and Earl rerouted JFK's motorcade.

So like they took it right by Dherald Bird's It's like come on. Yeah. Now it gets it gets even deeper because it's crazy, bro. Because uh you know de Harold Bird, you know that he had he's a big hunter, right? He he went after JFK got assassinated, he went to Africa on a safari and shot a bunch of elephants, brought their heads back and had them mounted on the wall in his big trophy room. A big trophy room full of all the animal heads that he of all the animals he killed and shot. You know what else he did? He took the window out of the sixth floor depository

and he put it in his trophy room at his What? Why? What? What reason for that? No way. That's crazy. [laughter] That's [ __ ] weird. Whoa. That is like, dude, that's red flags. That is huge. Huge red flags. And the fact that Ruth Payne knows de Harold Bird, she brings the Oswalds to Dallas, gives him this house to live in. And then all after the assassination, they go to Ruth Payne's garage, find all the evidence that that and then about a month after

sense with the narrative of, you know, what is he just trying to kill someone to get famous? Is that is that Lee who who we think Lee Harvey Oswald is? You know, that people, oh, poor Oswald, you know, was just this innocent guy who was just a weirdo and you he was just a fall guy, you know, and didn't have anything to do with it. That's not true at all. He was CIA that well he was actually trained by an office of naval intelligence wasn't CIA and he was in this thing called Operation [ __ ] It was a whole different operation. Uh but the bottom line is he ended up being part of this thing that was called uh

the in the field intelligence uh and it was it was a kind of a private uh spying operation the political spying operation that was going on. the William D. Paulie and uh and uh uh uh Hunt eh Hunt and a lot of guys they were funding it and that was Willoughby George Willoughby Charles Willoughby rather because at when when Truman got not fired he Truman wasn't fired he was he was re so what were these operations Lee Harvey Oswald was involved in? He was doing

Gordon Noville is the guy that was arrested and prosecuted by James Garrison in New Orleans for burning down 555 Camp Street, the office where where uh where uh Lee Hos Oswald had the office along with uh uh what was the name? uh the guy that was the hardcore right-wing guy that was the head of the Latin American uh uh anti-communist league. Uh one of the the

Robert Bigalow and stuff. Okay. So, so this is all so crazy. So, what is Lee Harvey Oswald doing exactly? He's inserting himself into like he he he is he is uh in addition to spying on different liberal liberal groups like ACLU and other things that he's doing and filing reports with this field intelligence operation going on that that what he's doing is he's infiltrating the the Free Cuba group uh and pretending to be a a Marxist, you know, just like he when he went to

Russia and did all that stuff. And so what he was doing is he was designing a character of being uh involved with Russia and with uh with Cuba. Uh and what what the the plan was is to coax him into taking a shot at the motorcade, not hitting anybody, but taking a shot at the motorcade. Uh and then he would uh he would escape, but they would have they would figure out who it was. There's the gun and there's who he is. and that they would blame it on Cuba and

they could get back to invading the island. You know, again, it was the same guys, the same kind hardcore right-wing guys that are into this. And so he's he's all put into place to take this shot at the motorcade and then run and Uh and what happens, he takes the shot at the motorcade, hits the curb, and chips the the curb, the pieces of the cement flying. Mhm. And immediately these other shots rang out uh and kill the president. Right. So you think Oswald missed?

Oh, he didn't miss. He wasn't intending to hit him. He wasn't even What was What was the point? Really? The point was to have a fire a gun a shot fired at the motorcade to be a a bungled attempt to assassinate the president and blame it on Oswald who was a Cuban operations guy so that they could then justify invading the island. Yeah. Because that's that was the whole plan. A very subtle plan and he was involved in that part. And when he he fired the shot, why didn't they end up using him as oh

like he was this Cuban operative? Because they did that didn't end up being the narrative like we need to retaliate against Cuba. Well be because because he killed he killed uh uh uh the police offic you know because the whole idea is there's a dead guy. a lone gunman, dead guy, you know that he took the shot at the president. You rotten bastards. You know, you're a Cuban, you know, spy. And you know, and what was his association with Cuba He was uh he he was part of the uh Free

Cuba group. He he infiltrated the group. That was when he got arrested on the street, remember? By by, you know, sitting on the street corner championing Where what year is this? In 1963. Okay. 1963. And he's he's chanting Free Cuba like in New Orleans or where in uh in New Orleans. This is amazing. Yeah. So, so he he was creating this character who was a who was kind of a zany guy who'd been to Russia and it was in favoring Cuba and then he was going

to take a shot at the uh thing and he thought he was supposed to help get escaped. The whole theory was he was going to they were going to help him escape. Yeah. Uh and then but they were going to blame it on him but he's already in some safe haven. But in reality, they were just going to take him out. They were going to kill him. And then he killed Tippet. That's right. As soon as he saw Tippet, he just killed him, you know, and and got arrested for it. You know, and uh so then that's why he kept saying, "Wait a second. I'm just a pathy here. Something's wrong." I'd like some legal representation.

These police officers have not allowed me to to have any. I uh I don't know what this is all you the president? I work in that building. Were you in the building all the time? Naturally, if I work in that building? Yes, sir. Back up, man. No, they're taking me in because of the fact that I live in the Soviet And he tried to place the call. He asked for the telephone call to Nag Nags Head.

Which is [ __ ] That was that was the whole operation where he was dipped. That's he was the ship. It was erased. Yeah. And and so so the bottom line and that whole thing, the the role of him, you know, that it really disappoints half of the the c the Castro assass or the the Kennedy assassination community. Oh, no, wait a second. He's supposed to be a completely innocent guy. Didn't have anything to do with it. You know, wasn't involved with these people at all. And they're just these weird things, you know, that that Garrison in

in in New Orleans was way off base, but he wasn't. you know that that whole crowd was part of that, you know, in Guy Banister and that whole crow Banister was the head of the the Central American chapter of the World Anti-Communist You know, You know, that's that's who they are, you know, and that's what he was part of. Uh and uh so that that's that's how the that's how the thing came down. And of course, as soon as it happened, all the people that knew about the S

Cuban. He's out of place and he's sitting he's sitting right next to the umbrella man. And the umbrella man's never been really solved. They they came out with this guy they said was the umbrella man in the in ' 74 at the House Select Committee. That's not the dude. Come on now. There was a different guy there with the umbrella symbolizing you didn't have the umbrella to of the air support to help with the Bay of Pigs and now we're going to get you. and also being the signal man on the grassy and all. Did you know that there were three yellow painted lines right on the side of the curb where the shot in in conjunction where all the

shots took place in the in the kill zone and they were painted the night before cuz Beverly Oliver was standing on one. She can be seen in the in the Zapruder film standing on the yellow curb on the edge of the edge of the sidewalk on Elm and she got yellow paint all over her shoe cuz it was freshly painted the night before. Wow. Now, there's no known parking on Elm Street, so there's no reason to paint the curb yellow. Everyone everyone knows there's no parking there. It's an on-ramp to the freeway to the Stemmans freeway. You know, nobody nobody pulls over there and parks, so there's no reason to paint the curb unless you're marking the the

shots for the kill zone. Were there any other actors or or people worthy of consideration as far as the involvement here? Yeah, I mean that that the the the question as to how many of the people in Brown brothers Heramman had to sign off on this, you know, other than Delos. Uh and the the real power was sort of in Sullivan and Cromwell, that whole law firm, you know, that's not a normal law firm, Sullivan and Cromwell. There was legal counsel for

Brown Brothers Herman. the Cromwell or Sullivan and Cromwell is the guy that choreographed the the overthrowing of the Panameanian government to build the Panama Canal. I mean, it's it's sort of it was sort of like uh uh Williams and Yeah. Yeah. It's not like a normal law You know, that's like Sullivan and Cromwell was that back at those times. So, so the the bottom line is that's what happened. And then as soon as the people realized what had happened, they said, "Shit, it's the S force,

you know, so we got to do everything in our power to cover this thing up because anybody finds out it's the S force, they're going to track it all the way back through to the agency and they're going to blame this on the agency." Whereas it wasn't the agency as such that did it. It was Dulles, you know, in his capacity as the con sigliier basically for Brown Brothers Haramman, you know, in that whole China lobby operation. And so the agency went to great lengths to conceal this. Uh and then they briefed LBJ. LBJ goes and gets

a hold of Earl Warren and says, "Justice Warren, Chief Justice Warren, you got to chair this commission because we really got to quell any of these concerns about a conspiracy." And look at one thing that you got to do. And and he didn't want to do it. And so he said, "Look, let me tell you why you have to do this." He said because he says you've got to be sure to conceal the fact that there was an assassination team that was that was assigned to try to kill Castro and it was the Kennedys that put it together. And if the word gets out that

there was an assassination team that Kennedy put together to try to kill Castro, everybody's going to believe that Castro found out about it and killed the president. And if that happens, you know, people are going to go crazy and they're going to try to make us invade Cuba. And if we do that, Russia is going to cause a world war. And he they lie to to Chief Justice Warren to Chief Justice Warren to get to chair the waring commission. And they put Alan Dulles on who was the de facto run guy that ran the Warren Commission,

you know, the whole thing to cover them all up. So crazy to cover the And what people do is people when they get little pieces of the information, they say, "Oh, this is the agency that killed him." Yeah. You know, and they kill him because he screwed up the Bay of Pigs. Did they get Jack Ruby to kill? What? What happened with Jack Ruby? I mean, that's all the mob. They said, "Wait, holy [ __ ] We We've messed up How did they How did they manipulate Jack Ruby into killing Lee Harvey He was He was a made man. He was a made man of the of the mob. You know, when

that he was involved in CIA mind control stuff. and he sees Jack Ruby for 24 hours totally not filmed, you know, and comes out. Jack Ruby has a psychotic break and he starts, you know, saying that there are Jews outside his jail cell screaming or whatever and is never the same after And Jolly West does a press conference saying Jack Ruby has gone crazy, you know, he's lost his marbles or Um, and so so you can't depend on anything he says. Yeah. I mean, that's got to be pretty uh

But that but that would imply that the first time around he wasn't he wasn't MK Ultra because maybe he had something to share and they needed to scramble his brain. Yeah. No, no, the the in the the thing is is that just following AAM's razor that you get a real simple line and narrative of what really happened and then all kinds of activities that are undertaken to cover and conceal this, you know, end up being interpreted as your principle involved in making the plan to kill him. Uh because it makes it satisfies

people's other more sinister worldview, right? But [clears throat] but but the bottom line is that that the the threat that was going to come unraveled happened with the Watergate burglary. Because what happened is when as soon as the Democratic National Committee chooses Larry O'Brien to be the new head of the Democratic National Committee, it turns out previously 20 years he was the chief lobbyist for for Howard Hughes in Washington. This is an amazing part of your narrative which is that Larry

O'Brien is the number two or chief lobbyist for Howard Hughes. Howard Hughes was responsible on behalf of Nixon for setting up you know the S force and working with Trafocante. Y and so uh Nixon is because he was a longtime political opponent of JFK is freaked out that he's because he's running for president later. Yes. Um in the you know so this is in the 70s. He says he's he's freaked out that basically Larry O'Brien is going to out him as having killed his longtime

political opponent even though he set up the S force not to kill JFK. It was to take out Castro and Shavara, but he's freaked out that they have comprom. And if you look at what happened in the Watergate scandal, the burglary, it's James McCord is involved. You represented him, you know, in the in the afterwards. McCord was known as Dulles's number two and his favorite guy or what was, you know, his favorite understudy they put they bugged Larry O'Brien's phone. So clearly so clearly they were

targeting him and Nixon was way up against McGovern in the polls of that election. So you always have to ask the question, was it like he was paranoid, but was he that paranoid? Like why would he do that if it weren't this sort of specific thing he was worried about? That's right. Because because if O'Brien were to reveal the fact that he's the one that that created the assassination team that in fact killed the president, there's no way you can talk your way out of that in time in an election year from June between June and November. He's not

going to climb out under from under that. And so he said, "We've got to we've got to find out whether whether O'Brien knows about it and is thinking at all about using it. So we've got to not only wiretap his telephone, but bug his office." That's amazing. And that's what they did. and they sent him in to do it. So you you then are the the lawyer for James McCord. Well, it was Bailey. It was Bailey himself because Bailey, it turns out, was on index 4 for the agency. Which which we didn't know. Okay. You know, none of us knew it in the Did you learn anything from those guys

about like spooky intel world or like did did any of them sort of reveal any secret? Like did you interact with McCord at all or? No. Okay. No. that but but I I knew that McCord was was was uh didn't want to plead He was refusing to plead guilty. He said, "Why am I pleading guilty?" You know, that we got because he had been told that they were going in to to try to find evidence that that O'Brien and the other guys were were coordinating

and financing anti-war demonstrators. Uh and he wanted to get that information. And so he thought he was involved in kind of a a typical kind of, you know, uh I guess meat and potatoes kind of covert operation by the agency. Uh and they've been instructed that if you get caught doing a covert operation for the agency state side, which is totally illegal, call one of the people on the index 4. you [snorts] know, there's William Bennett Williams and then there's Bailey and there was this other guy Miller I knew about, you know,

but but I didn't know any of that when Bailey contacted me and asked me to come over to his shop to to be special counsel, uh, you know, for the burglary case. I want to pivot slightly. It's the same sort of uh you know world that we're talking about here. But um you have a very interesting narrative about how some of maybe the initial financing occurs for secret covert UFO programs in Oh yeah. And uh you you talk about this Anderson and uh you know billions of dollars

worth of lost gold. 1.2 trillion. There you go. At $32 an ounce. Which is now $3,400 an ounce. So what's what's the story there? Well, it's the the what happened is back in about 19 about 2000 uh it was just like 2000 year 2000 that uh Mr. Aya, who is like the third richest fellow in the entire Philippines, you know, contacts the Jesuit headquarters that he wanted to he

wanted to have somebody from the Jesuit headquarters because he'd gone to a Jesuit high school and college and stuff and wanted them to come and brief the top 50 business people in the Philippines about what the consequences of global climate change were going to be for the island. you know, with the rising sea levels is going to swamp parts of the island and ruin businesses. Uh, and so trying to see if they would mobilize the business community to do something about it, right? So, I got designated to go brief him. So, I fly I fly to the Philippines uh and Mr. Aya

puts me up in this like 20 star hotel, you know, with these this sumptuous food everywhere. All this bizarre kind of offensive uh kind of opulence. Uh, and you know, I go brief these guys and I tell them that uh, what they should do is they should try to mobilize and get the government of the Philippines uh, which they had some influence with these rich business guys, you know, to lead a the uh, uh, association of island states

uh, in the United Nations to mobilize a uh, a motion on the floor of the general assembly to have a uniting for peace resolution to have the islands states all joined together and accused the United States and uh and China and India of uh aggressive activities ruining their national security by the the fostering and promoting of the fossil fuels that are swamping their islands and ruining their country. uh and if you can get if I told him if you can get

twothirds of all the members of the general assembly 193 countries at that time you know to support such a resolution you can get an investigation done uh and if you can get three4s of them to vote for a resolution ordering those countries to start cutting back on all of their the use of petroleum you can enforce it and the security council can't veto it okay so I explained that all to them Uh, and then Mr. Ayat drives me up to his big mansion

on at top of the mountain overlooking Manila. And we're sitting there, you know, sipping lemonade one at an e afternoon. And he said, you know, uh, would you like to meet the the president of the Senate of the Philippines? And I said, "Yeah, that would be really helpful if we could get right to them, you know." And he said, "Well, let me let me get a hold of him." He gets up and leaves, goes in, makes a call, and he comes back, says, "Good. Let's go down and see him." So we go get in his big Cadillac. We drive down off the hill. He walks into the to the office of

the president of the Senate. Says hi to the secretary and we just walk in. We sit down. He introduces me to Senator Pimeintel who is the president of the of the Philippine Senate. And I'm briefing him on this how to go about you know spearheading organizing the Association of Island States to bring on a a motion under the Uniting for Peace Resolution. and he's he's listening to me, but he doesn't seem particularly enthralled about it all. Uh, and so then he he casually gets up and goes over and he

closes the door and comes and sits back down. He said, "Well, I should tell you." He said, "As the president uh of the of the Senate, you know, I Cherithan called the Blue Ribbon Commission, and the Blue Ribbon Commission is charged with finding these 176 troves of treasure that have been buried in the Philippines by General Yakushima at the end of World War II. Uh and each of them has like a hundred billion dollars of gold and silver uh in the platinum bars

and big 50 gallon drums of diamonds and rubies and and precious jewels that have all been pilferred by a special unit of the Japanese army that was deployed all during the 1930s before World War II started uh as a treasure, a war chest for the the war because they were and they were worried about being invaded or taken. Well, they yeah because they they knew that that once the Germans had surrendered in May of 1945 that it was just a matter of time that the US was going to invade the

island, you know, and and take them down. Uh and so they they were going to move all of the the treasure out of there uh out of Japan and they were going to bury it and they were going to sign General Yakushima himself to oversee all that. And they were going to send the uh the cousin I think of uh of uh Hiroshito, you know, uh to a prince, a Japanese prince of the royal family to accompany them so he would know where all 176 of these treasure troves were. Uh and so

they sent him into the islands and they started moving the the gold out in the last months of the war and they buried it. Uh and they buried them in these like you know like you know 500 600 ft deep you know big wells like that they drilled uh and then they were using uh prisoners of war to do the digging and then burying the team that dug that particular hole burying them with the gold so that no one would know be around to tell where it was. So where did where did this gold end up?

It ended up in the Philippines is there's 176 troves of these things. Still there. Still there. Oh yeah. So there is 1.5 trillion or 1.2 trillion worth of gold in the Philippines now. Oh 1.2 trillion was just about just 12 of the troves. There's 176 of them and they're still there. Yes, they're still there. So who's guarding over them? They they don't they can't find them. That that's what the problem is. They're crazy people running around the Philippines for decades trying to find these places, but they don't they don't

know where they are. But you but we have documentation that there are a lot of Oh yeah. That that that Marcos got two of them. Uh by by capturing one of the guys who was the uh who who who found one of them and they drilled the eyes out of his son right in front of him with a hot poker. Jesus. Marcos did. Colonel Ver, you know, did it. Who is who's Marcos? Marcos was the president of the of the Whoa. that uh that was who dr who drilled the general ver was

his kind of chief torturer and uh he tortured this guy's son right in front of him to get the guy to tell him where two of these little troves were you know and they got two of them Marco's got two of them each of hundred billion dollars but but so what does this have to do with UFO financ that no it doesn't as such what what we know is that that at the end of World War II after they done this after they'd buried them all and there were of of them

that what what happened is that Lansdale, Ed Lansdale, who was in the when they disbanded the OSS after the Germans uh uh surrendered in May of 45, the Truman disbanded the OSS and reassigned them all around and Ed Lansdale, who was an OSS guy, gets made to G2 uh in Manila, right? [clears throat] and he knows about the fact that this treasure has been buried around there. And so what he does is when when General Yakushima turns

himself in, you know, at the end of the war after the dropping the bombs, you know, in the in August 6th and 8th of 45, you know, they all surrender. uh so there's not going to be any kind of invasion to the and what what uh Japan was hoping that they could get a conditional surrender uh and that they would be able to keep custody of the Philippines so that they'd be able to then later go in and dig these things up and have you know re constitute the wealth of the Japanese empire right that

was the [clears throat] plan but the US bombs them instead uh and says you know it's an unconditional surrender you don't get the Philippines We keep the Philippines, right? [clears throat] And so and so what happens is is uh Ed Lansdale Ed Lansdale uh knows that these are here and so these these treasure troves are there. So what he does is he he kidnaps the driver for General Yakushima who would know where the some of them were, right? And so he has him

tortured. This guy name is Santo Mar Santa Mario. uh uh S Santo Mario. Yeah, it's his name. Uh this corporal that actually conducted the torturing of of this driver. Uh and they find out where 12 of the troves are. Uh so they punch the first one uh and find the hundred billion dollars. Uh I've seen photographs of of the I mean it looks it's like a football stadium down underneath the ground, you know, that goes down like five six hundred

feet. huge ca caverns down there and stacks of gold bullion, you know, you know, armpit high as far as you can see, you know, and big barrels of of jewels everywhere. And the bottom line is they they punch 12 of these things. And so, uh, so Lansdale, after punching the first one and verifying that that it's for real, he gets in a plane, he flies, uh, from Manila to Singapore to see MacArthur. and he goes in to see MacArthur uh personally and starts to

tell him what they've got here, right? And MacArthur brings in his G2, who's Charles Willoughby. Uh and so MacArthur orders Willoughby to go with Ed Lansdale in MacArthur's private plane and they fly him from Singapore back to Manila back into the the Philippines and back into the United States. Right. and they they go to see to tell Truman that they've got $1.2 trillion dollars uh in gold, bullion, and in platinum and

in uh in silver and jewels. Uh and the the chief of staff won't let them see him uh unless he they tell him what they want to talk about. So they brief the chief of staff who is Clark Clifford. So Clifford comes into the meeting uh with Truman uh with Ed Lansdale and with Willoughby and start [clears throat] to brief Truman about what they've got. Truman says, "Hold a second. I' I've got to bring uh Stimson in." Brings in the

Secretary of War Stimson. Brings him in. As soon as Stimson starts realizing what they've got, he sends for his three deputies and he he brings in Robert Levit uh and Robert Anderson, both not only deputy secretaries of war, but senior partners in Brown Brothers and and John J. Mcclo. And they bring them in, the three deputies. They find out what they've got here. And Truman decides that what he's going to do, he's not going to tell anybody. He's not going to tell the Congress. He's not

going to tell anybody else about it. They're going to set up this secret uh uh trust they call the Anderson Trust. They set it up down in Houston, Texas. And they they set up the the Anderson Trust and they have all this and they they assign we we now know we've got the He's still alive. The the commander, the pilot that flew the flew the gold out. He's alive. Yes, he's alive. Have you spoken to him? We know what I'm going to Whoa. We're going to We know right where he is now. and and I'm going to I'm going to talk to him, you know, to get this thing on

the record. Whoa. Yeah. But so the so they fly the using US military transports. They fly these these this gold all out of there, you know, these 12 trolls of it and they bring it to the International Credit Bank in Geneva, Switzerland, and they deposit it there and then they issue gold certificates on it, which are like bearer bonds, you know, and and they they make they distribute them to right-wing anti-communist candidates for mayors and stuff after World War II, you

know, all throughout Europe. Wow. in there. So there's this whole covert program of So this has nothing to do with UFOs? no. No, no, no. But what it is is it's a it's a a mechanism for secretly funding covert operations that are going on after World War II uh when the CIA is set up and they're all funding this stuff. And that's Dulles knows about this money that's there. So that they're they're using this for covert Interesting. you know, yeah, it's wild. That's wild.

It's it's it's totally separate from the the UFO stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think Chris Ramsay, who just did a great interview with you, Yeah. told me maybe he thought it had something to do with UFOs. So, I'll use this as a a opportunity to say, "Chris, why'd you leave me astray?" And but go watch your interview with Chris because I thought that was great. I don't know if you've seen it, but it was fantastic. It was really great. Yeah, I I don't see I don't see most of these things. I just, you know, when I with somebody that I trust anyway that I can just tell you and so it's done

so I know that you guys will tell other Check it out. Area 52. Um yeah, in that interview you actually talk about uh an interview with a live alien being. Uh at S4 in Area 51. That's right. And uh yeah, you care to go into any detail around that? Well, yeah. I got at Jesuit headquarters. Uh let me see. It must be about uh let's see when that would be. Uh it was 94

that I'd already done the uh the John Max stuff. Uh so it was it was like 2000 uh 2001 2002 something like that that uh I I get a call uh from a guy uh in northern Minnesota and [clears throat] he's uh on his deathbos right uh and he wants me to come and see him there's something and he says that he worked directly with project blue and so I said uh oh uh okay so I fly

there and fly into Minneapolis and rent a little car and drive up into this little teeny town up in northern Minnesota. Uh, and there he is. He's at this little hospice place with he's got one of these little rollers with all the little bottles on it, the stuff in his nose. And he starts telling me how uh he was a uh a clerk typist, army, US army clerk typist assigned to this special unit of project blue book that was focusing just on the 700 or so

uh cases of of of instance incidents which they couldn't explain away. They were just too credible. The the sources were too credible. They had too many people had seen it. What was his name? that his his name was uh Oscar uh Wolf. Oscar Oscar Wolf or Oscar Lane. Oscar Yes. Oscar Wolf. That's who he was. Uh and uh and uh he he starts telling me about it all. Uh and goes into detail about it. Uh now it's one of these

bizarre things cuz I my my my office people said you got to bring a camera. You got to bring a camera to get this guy if he's going to give you a Did you record him? Yeah, I I I brought the little thing. I set it all up on the little table. And And so I had the whole the whole thing recorded. Uh and it got corrupted But I think Jeremy Corbel might have recorded an interview with this guy Later he did. And he also he also talked with Richard Dolan.

Okay. So we have him on record. Oscar and Well, they but the thing is they didn't press into as far as I know about this incident. Oh, really? And he and he told me about the fact that he cuz I kept they missed the they buried the lead. Well, yeah, cuz I was interrogating the [ __ ] out of him, you know. I mean, I was just pressing down on him because I figured he was on his bed. So, so yeah, don't don't mess with me. So she shape up you know these days the dying

I could have worse I could have said you know if you want any absolution you know but I didn't do that part so so so man the Jesuits are thugs that's that's being too tough you know and so so so the bottom line he tells me that that uh that the reason that he has developed this kind of special relationship with the commander of this unit that is assigned specifically to investigate the the uh the these 700 other cases, right, is because he and the commander were both part of this

really fundamentalist Christian sect called the worldwide church of God. I mean, apparently really hardcore fundamentalist crowd [clears throat] and and uh and so that he he stayed there for years when they were working on it. people would come and go and the staff and do field investigations and all that, but he kept staying there and keeping records and then his commander comes in and said that he is going to be going to Area 51 and uh wanted Oscar to come with him. And so he did. He went

with him. But it turns out it was not just Area 51, it was S4. So they actually went all the way to S4 uh and went down in the big elevators and went in and he said he saw like three or four. By the way, S4 isn't supposed to officially exist. So, it's important. The only versions where it exist, you have Bob Lazar, you have a guy named Dan Berish, and you have this story. That's right. And I think we're going to get some more corroboration soon that S4 does in fact exist. And then then all of a sudden, you start asking questions about these specific stories and it

starts to blow your mind. Okay. So, you're going down. So, so he goes down and he says and he sees like there's three or four uh UFOs that are just they they've got little like uh little garages like these these little chambers the same story as Bob Lazar and they're just they're just hovering in there. They're he said they were just they were just hovering all by themselves inside these little garages like that were underground. He said he saw them uh and then they went in and his his commander was going to be quote interviewing a

live ET guy, right? So he goes with him uh and they come into this other area where there were military guys there. He said, but there was this room like a standalone room with these big two-way mirrors that that you could see through uh from the outside. And he said he saw the ET guy, but he was like, you know, five and a half feet tall. No, it wasn't a little tiny short guy. It was a kind of a kind of lifesiz guy. So big big

head, big eyes, and he was in this kind of jumpsuit that they'd provided for him. Uh he was he was very cooperative. He wasn't being speaking English or No, no, he was it was all telepathic. It was all telepathic. So they just he just saw them sitting across from each other. He could see he could see his commander walk in but he wouldn't go cuz he said he said I thought it was demonic. That's what he said. He said I thought it was demonic and I didn't want to go near him. Uh and so he stayed outside and but he could see his his commander having this

kind of telepathic communication going on with him. Right. And his commander was a fundamentalist Yeah. Yes. And so and so how what was the communication like that that he didn't say? He just said it was telepathic. He could tell that they were having this telepathic Well, he he probably afterwards got it confirmed by his his commander that it was all telepathic. He they weren't talking. He could just see that they were having this kind of communication. Did he seem honest to you? Oh, yes. So, you think that happened? Yeah, I do think that happened. I think

that happened, you know. And uh So, you think we have alien beings at Well, no. No. All I all I know is I think that there was one there. Okay. at that time at that time and that he saw him uh and that he he stayed outside and the the military guys that were there showed him these these cards. They had he said they had these index cards that and it didn't say whether they were typed up or printed, but they had the questions and answers that were there of

things they'd ask him, right? And so they had a little record of interviews that had been conducted with him. And in one of them he said that uh they asked him you know so where are you guys from? What are you what are you doing here? And he said that you know he was part of a group uh of people beings from different star systems in our galaxy. He said and that their job was to go around monitoring where life had started in different planets

inside the galaxy. uh and that that was what they did. Uh and that's what they were doing here. And he said uh they asked him, "Well, who's who tasked you to do that?" You know, who's in charge of that? He said, "Well, it's what you people would refer to as God, but it's very different than you think." Then how is it different? He didn't say. He didn't say. And he said, "But I didn't believe him." He said, "Because I thought he was demonic." And so I never told anybody. I never called anybody

about this. Have you ever heard the term Collins Do you think that that this kind of fundamentalist Christian commander was involved in the Collins elite or No, it didn't didn't seem to be. This was kind of an individual thing with him and this guy cuz they also thought that the the alien stuff was kind of demonic. Oh, yeah. No, no, that there's there's a whole a whole stream of that in the fundamentalist world. you know, I've got, you know, that Sarah's uh sister-in-law

is a big fundamentalist, you know, and she will, she thinks the whole thing is That's it's a it's a meme. Have you ever interviewed I mean, I'm sure part of it is and part of it might be angelic and, you know, it's like I I think that it's because people don't that whole part. People don't understand angelic. probably good and bad is probably way too simplistic of a frame for whatever they're operating on. And I'm sure there are good ones that incidentally do violence to you because of their kind of, you know, field or

whatever. Once you, you know, it's like St. Franc St. Francis of Bisi has a vision of this, you know, um, kind of, you know, winged angel being. It was a flaming torch in the original translation, but as a and it does violence to him, but it's like it's that becomes part of his conversion towards God and it ends up sort of killing him. But I think the sort of good bad, you know, dichotomy is probably a earthly one that Yeah. Well, there's there's I mean an awful lot of anthropomorphic projection, you know, onto these folks. Well,

because they because they're so much like us. I mean, you know, that that's a real challenge. Have you ever met an alien? No. Would you want to? Sure. Yeah. I'd like to sit down and and chat with them. Yeah. And and and actually figure out, you know, how to kind of represent us. You know, and in a full way about good and bad stuff that we do, all of us, you know, but try to figure out what the criteria are for trying to establish a

relationship of trust with them and and how we could trust them. what can they do to kind of assuage the concerns that people have about them in their kind of secretive ways, you know? Have you ever seen So, you've seen picture of a UFO which was in the Blue Book Files in a skiff in DC and you even It wasn't a skiff though. Oh, it wasn't a skiff. Okay. No, it was just it was just this room that they had downstairs in the Madison. And you traced the uh symbols that were along the the edge of the craft. I did

know seems to have his hand in everything. Um what do you think of Hal and his role and kind of uh I think I think Hal is uh is more knowledgeable uh in depth about this whole thing than most any of the people that you would you know can and know uh you know and that that uh do you think he says everything he knows? No. Oh, no. No. He doesn't even pretend to.

No. He doesn't even pretend to say everything he knows. Do you think he's worked on a craft or seen a craft? Oh, I'm sure he has. You're sure he has? No, I'm I'm completely sure he has. Really? Yeah. Do you think he knows how they fly? No, he has a better idea of how they fly than most anybody. You know, there may be some technicians that that know more about some details. Do you think he understands a lot about sort of um I don't know uh the mental networks and that sort of thing? Do you think he's

sort of clued into that? Yeah. Oh yeah. Oh, I mean that that's his major focus from Stargate is is Yeah. What's the connection between remote viewing and you know so you had these guys in the remote viewing program like Stargate, you know, which formed by the CIA and later run out of the DIA 1972. He um you know that some of these guys like Ingo Swan would like remote view alien bases on the moon and things like I talked I talked to Ingo about it. Did Yeah. I spent like a whole day with Ingo

in No apartment in New York. What did What did Ingo say about the alien bases? It was interesting that that that my my access to him came through the Church of Scientology thing. You know that that's a big deal. Yeah. uh that Church of Scien Hal put off at Church of Scientology and in uh uh Tar Russell Tar was Church of Scientology all kinds of the guys were to catch people up you kind of won Elron Hubard's favor by uh you know there was a case against them around uh you know

said, look, as a condition preceded to even being willing to meet with him, to talk with him, I'd have to be given permission to have access to whatever records or information there is anywhere in the world about the church. Uh, and I said, that's I assume that's a total non-starter, right? And they give you their records. Within a week, they came back and said, it's a deal. What do you want to see? And so I So you could query anybody's e-meter Anything I could get anything I wanted. And so uh they flew me down to uh to

Florida uh and the big blue cube they've got down there, this big huge blue building. Uh and uh so I go in and there's the head of the Guardians office, US Guardians office and the international head of the Guardians, you know, out of the UK. Uh and they say uh says, "So what do you want to see?" And I said, "Uh, well, first what I want to see is the file you got on me." Uh, in the American guy said, 'N no. Why? No, we've got I don't know. And I said, excuse me. I said, what do you

think? I fell off some melon wagon somewhere. I said, you know, you're going to have me be Elron Hubard's attorney. You don't have any file on me at all. And the international guy says, go get him the file, you know. So, they bring me the file. I'm going through. How deep was it? How much stuff did they Well, they had they had, you know, pictures pictures of me. What was you know I was at I was a Jesuit candidate. I was at the headquarters you know they were following me around. They showed me in different restaurants you know and meeting with people you know Mark Lane and some of the other guys you know they lane he was like uh Kennedy assassination investig

author of that you know so you know they had all these kind of things and so I said okay good I just wanted to make sure that it was that it was accurate you know and then so the international guy says to me he says okay so what else do you want to see? I said, 'I want to see the three most sensitive files in the entire world according to you as the head of the guardian's office, you know. And he just went, "Oh, fuck." He said, I said, "So, so either you get them or not, you know, so he gets up and is gone and rebel is around, comes back, he ends up uh laying

one of the the files in front of me. Uh, and I started looking at it and it was all reports by Ingo Swan." Ingo Swan was filing reports with the head Guardian office in in UK about the entire internal operations of the office of naval intelligence uh remote viewing program that they were doing. He was just giving him all the information and so he was a spy or something. Yeah, he was a spy for the Church of For the Church of Scientology over and against the Office of Naval

Why would he do that? Because he was a high level clearer. That was his loyalty group. His fundamental loyalty. He was loyal to them prior to That's right. That's right. Over and above. Over and because I always I always thought Put was like looking into that stuff because he was like an NSA guy before he was Scientology guy. So I thought put off was just like tasked to like looking into this you know very uh you know uh para governmental intelligence organization that is Scientology that's seen as a threat and so you know put get

put off in there. No, this this was a stuff. I mean, the the Church of Scientology, you're not aware of it, that their highest principle Yeah. in the Church of Scientology is all to do with UFOs. Yeah. They they believe that there is a major confrontation going on between the uh the humanlike people from the Pletes over and against the reptilians from Zeta Reticuli. and that there's a major confrontation going on over which of them is going to actually assert uh

so good at remote viewing that they assigned him a task of they gave him the exact longitude and latitude down to the minute and second location. Uh and he was assigned [snorts] an artist so that he didn't have to do these hen scratches trying to show it. But he was and he was saying you know I so what's there? So there's this major building here. And there's big big fence up there with razor wire on the top of it and everything. And his facilitator uh was was uh uh Russell Tar.

And so Russell was saying, "Okay, now can can you get inside the fence? Can you see anything inside the fence?" He goes, "Okay. Uh all right. Yeah, I can I can see inside the fence. There's just this no man's land there. Can you get to the front door of this place?" And he said, "All right." He said, "Okay." All right, I got it. Yeah, okay. I'm in front of the front door. He said, can you go inside the building? He said, uh, let me see here. Uh, okay. Yeah, yeah, I can see I can see inside the building here. He said, so what do you see? There's this big long hallway. Uh,

there's some doors on both sides. And Russell said, now go down to the third door on the left. Uh, he said, okay. He said, can you go into the room? Yeah, I can go into the room. So, what do you see? Well, there's big desk there and chairs and stuff. There's a big file cabinet over in the right corner over here. Go over to the file cabinet. So, it goes over the file cabinet. There's a second drawer, first file. Read it to him. And he did. What was it?

nuclear submarine, and show it to him and say, "Where is it right now?" and he would give them right down to the exact longitude and latitude down to the minute and second of exactly where that is. And he visualized the whole thing and told them exactly where it was, but there was a huge UFO right over the top of the water where that thing was and it was tracking it and monitoring it. And he had it [laughter] in the file, you know, I'm going, "Whoa." I said, "This is uh this

brought him to this little facility. It was like this little domed little building uh and it had these big huge uh uh dishes on top, these communication dishes on top. and they brought him in and they sat him down uh and they put this helmet on him uh and they had him think uh a particular message and they turned all the d the antenna down to the northern peninsula of Michigan, that little section that's in there, and had him be telepathically projecting, you

when it comes time for you to file your your national uh your US income tax forms next year, file them in this little post office box down this little town down in West Virginia and 85% of the people did it next year. No way. Absolutely way. That's insane. It's You keep saying that. So you're saying you're saying you're saying Scientology had some sort of mind mass mind control. That wasn't the Church of Scientology.

What was it? This was the program. That was the program. The Office of Naval Intelligence. This was the program. But that's that's like the implications of that are crazy. Would you No, they're profound. And so then I from then Yeah. So you met Ingo Swan. Yeah. I didn't say no to them then, but as soon as I saw the the file on the fair game, I knew I wasn't going to do it, but I had the opportunity to go see So I contacted Ingo and said, you know, I'm being asked to be the lawyer for for uh Hubard and you know, I want to chat with you. I went to see him at his

apartment in New York and we go all the way upstairs up onto the roof of his apartment that he's got there and then I started talking to him. Uh and and I I didn't want to freak him out over the fact that he was clearly violating his security clearance, you know, by providing these reports to the Church of Scientology. So he was using his remote viewing from Stargate in the reports that he was g giving to the Church of Scientology. Yeah. He he was filing not only about

Oh, yeah. Because because he he in one of his reports uh had uh had uh a report in there about uh it was it was uh uh uh Hal put off. No, it wasn't hell. It it was uh Tar, Russell Targ had been facilitating a remote viewing by Pat uh when they when they stepped it up from him being able to remote view

things in real time to be able to be shown a photograph of a Russian Boomer and then he could locate it. M he could figure out exactly where it was down to the minute and second of longitude and latitude. I mean, which was the big deal, you know? I mean, that's the big deal. And, uh, and, uh, and when they found it, uh, when they found it and verified that it was there through the remote viewing, others to find it, there was a

hovering right over the top of where the Russian Boomer submarine was going under the water, and it was monitoring it. Uh, and uh, and I when I saw it, I just Did you see a photo? No. Okay. No, they just told me about it. It was a written report that they that it was there and it was just my it was following right along where the Russian boomer submarine was going, you know, and that was the only piece that was in there except when I when I started interrogating people, you know, cuz I I wanted to get as much advantage

as I could of the opportunity that I had here to get information. So, I got to meet the guy who was legal counsel for the uh church to ask him to explain to me, you know, what the net net of all this was. You know, what were they up to here? And what it is is that they they considered themselves entitled to being considered a sovereign entity because the Catholic Church was. So, the Catholic Church has this kind of status of being a sovereign entity in a nation basically because they have Vatican State, right? So they they

insisted that as a matter of first amendment uh equal protection that they were entitled to take under themselves the same status. And so that's what caused them to be engaged in this fair game program. They believed that they had a right to engage in like wet you know, like the United States does and Russia does and all of that and which they asserted, you know, the Vatican does. as they said. Do you think do you think that the Vatican and the specifically maybe the Knights of Malta had anything to do with the UFO kind of reverse engineering or

transport or oversight? I think that an element of the Knights of Malta have something to do with everything. And and why do you think that? Because of the people that that were in this uh this Monte Carlo group. There's a thing called the Monte Carlo group that is at the top top of the entire nice of Malta structure. Uh and uh and I discovered that there were non-atholics in it. Which didn't make any sense to me at all because nights of Malta is a Catholic

men's club like thing. But there's a there's this uh high executive council that turned out that Henry Kissinger was on it. Mhm. uh and uh and uh in George Bush was that who's Episcopal? That's amazing. Well, if I were but if I were to play devil's advocate, I could have said Council Foreign Relations, Bilderberg, you know, like I could name five other organizations that those two guys were a part of. Um any other reasons to believe they had something to do with the UFO?

No, just No, just not specifically. What I'm saying is that anybody who is at that level dealing with international things would have to be involved in this. There's no way that you're not going to be involved in this because I mean you could be involved in all the other stuff and it wouldn't make any difference ultimately, you know. I mean this whole thing could to use a phrase trump you know everything. What is the is there kind of a mandate or you know constitution for the Knights of Malta? I mean the the only references

I really have are you know Humphrey Bogart the Maltese falcon they were supposed to be the guardians of this Maltese falcon and I believe they're also the heirs to the hospital you know there was the kind of templars back in the day sort of you know um pre-13th century when they were they were disbanded I guess 14th century um and then they were kind of the guardians of these pilgrims that would go to the temple mount in you know Jerusalem and then the IC side of that was the hospital and so that sort of there's some lineage

between that and you know knights of but otherwise I don't really understand you know what they do. I know they have sovereign status and they [clears throat] can kind of they do they're a military they're a military order uh and they're they're a sovereign they're a sovereign military order uh and it's it's it's very clear that you know there guys like Reinhard Galen was in the Knights Knights of Malta that was a former Nazi yeah Reinhard Galen is the guy that was the head of the antis-siet and anti- Eastern black intelligence for the Third

uh and also became the director of intelligence for West Germany at the end of World War II, you know, at the behest of our OSS. We got him put in you know, and Shackley worked directly with him, you know. Yeah. And and uh and also um Auto another former Nazi. Yeah. Auto Scorzani, who ran the rat you know, of of smuggling them all out of there. And they were knights of Malta That were used.

Did you I mean, you're a Jesuit. Did you ever use your Jesuit connections to figure out more about the Magenta crash which was supposedly recovered, you know, according to David Grush? It was recovered in Lombardi in 1933. And uh I believe the cardinal of Milan was also of Knight of Malta at the time. And the UFO supposedly made itself to the Vatican where it was held for a while and then I think Pope Pas the 6th maybe uh then you know transferred it

over to the US the Pope P the 11th. Okay. Transferred it over to the US. Um so do you know anything about that or No, I didn't actually. It's interesting Do you believe that's a real case or it's it's interesting. I didn't know about it. I didn't know about it until comparatively recently. Uh so that one never came across the radar. So I I had been pretty well locked down on You got to hit up your Vatican contacts. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Right. Those that are still alive anyway, you know. I mean,

shows his overall worldview at the end of this you know decade plus long inquiry into the UFO alien question. Yeah. He he he really views the entire UFO ET issue as a as a as a window opening onto the functioning of world views, you know, in and in and our human family to really explain an awful I had something to do with that cuz that's what I was talking to him about. He and I just before he got killed, we were

planning on trying to set up a thing When you say he got killed, was that do you think it was intentionally or accidental? car. Yeah. Yeah. No, it was Yeah, I was on that within hours after it happened, you know, dug it out and knew who the guy was. The guy still in prison that that ran him down. He was just drunk and uh you know Yeah. And uh so so that the uh that John and I were talking about the fact that that this was a uh actually

the name of his manuscript is When Worldviews Collide. Mhm. And you know all the Velikovski that you know from when Worlds Collide stuff. So that's what he did when Worlds Uh and what was the Velikovski? What was the When Worlds Collide? What was that When Worlds Collide is an old classic uh piece that Velikovski wrote. It's the theory that the asteroid belt uh is a another planet that was here in

that encapsulated life beyond humans. If you want to shatter the western mental structures the the western mind so to speak which is now permeating the whole earth in its materialist dualistic philosophy. The way you do it is you take something that's supposed to be in the spirit world because even in the west we can make allowance for the spirit world. We can study it through mythology, through religion, through imagination, through poetry. But the one

and then started the PhD work at Harvard uh on that very issue. uh trying to under trying to understand things. When you get a really complex issue, what you want to do is figure out what the kind of operational pieces of it are so you can get them spread out in front of him just like a plane wreck. You know, you want to kind of reassemble the pieces that you can recover and take a look at it. And what this does is it tends to shake down into this octave of human worldviews. You know that the that only one aspect of which is their

political manifestation. you know, that that runs from from right to left, you know, from the authoritarian to the reactionary to the conservative to the moderate to the liberal to the progressive to the utopianist, you know, that there's there's a there are integrated worldviews. They're internally self-reerentially consistent, you know, and that they're all predicated upon the answers that you provide to these four pillar questions about the origins of the universe, the kind of end

product, the teological outcome of the universe is projected. You know, what the analogical relationship between consciousness and the material manifestation uh of reality is the big one. And the epistemological question is you know that what means do we have at our disposal as human beings by means of which you can possibly answer questions like that. Are we limited to our five senses or do we have other faculties? Do we have other kind of charisms that we have access to that have been hidden or

You know that those are those are the fundamental questions. Uh those are the sort of cosmic questions. And since we don't have the definitive answer to any of those yet, uh the way as long as long as you have a internally and self-referentially consistent answer to all four of those you have a worldview. It's a systematic worldview. And if you can discern what the common principle is that makes all of them similar to each other, the answers are consistent with

each other. You apply that principle to any question that you confront uh in making your judgments. Uh and then you have a philosophy. That's that's what a philosophy is is a consistent application of a single principle that is generic to all four of these fundamental questions. If you can do that and that that's what a philosophy is and then you have a sub component of that, your political philosophy and then you have a mode of spiritual expression.

which is generic to that. That's where you get these major world religions that are generic to a particular worldview, you know. And so I would I was starting to explain all that to him that that I discovered, you know, when I actually went back to talk to John RWS, who's head of the department of philosophy at Harvard, you know, when I was running into these conflicts that I was having with the different lawyers and the firms where I was, you know, they all seem to be functioning on some different wavelength. So what did what did Mac think you know when what would happen

when world views collided and when uh he he believes that that it's absolutely clear that there's that the initial response that we have as human beings as homo sapien to an encounter with an extraterrestrial being uh is that it it uh kind of shatters uh the the kind of uh walls uh of the room uh the mansion of our worldview, you know, that all of

a sudden the things are so completely different than anything you'd ever assume before that your world can fall apart as it were. Uh and so people and people have this kind of cellular uh response when you find yourself actually confronted with an extraterrestrial being that your whole cellular system reacts in a in a kind of fightor-flight way uh that your subconscious doesn't have any control over. it just you just freak out, you

know, and and so but we so we started deciding that what we wanted to do is help train people uh that had consistent repeated encounters, you know, because we found that to be a fairly common theme that if you've been abducted once, you've been usually abducted more than right? And so that that if it's going to happen again to try to train a person through holotropic breathing to kind of just calm themselves down and to get centered to try to get mastery over that kind of cellular response that your body

because all of us that are alive right now are the end of the chain of I mean that's what's distinguished us, you know, that that that our our lineage have all survived and gotten us through fascinating though. He's talking about almost a like a manual for being physiologically ready for contact. That's right. Absolutely right. To try to overcome the cellular imprint that we have in us to react, the allergic reaction. And it is like if you're, you know, like the threebody problem, if you're in the dark forest and you are afraid of making

contact, it's actually adaptive to sort of hide yourself, you would want to know that the other side is sort of receptive and stable and going to be okay. Yes. You know, when you when you uh appear. That's right. Cuz if you uh you know cause Oh, they get they get in trouble. I mean, you know, Karen, one of the they used to throw things at them. I mean, she'd throw lamps. She was one of Max. She was one of one of That's a little crazy. Yeah. And and she was one of the first people who really got the the holotropic breathing training. So, are you going to release this book or what what are you what are you what

child birth or when he was very young? No. In fact, his mother played this really kind of major role in Okay. because he when when he first got dragged up or when he first started encountering uh these highle military that were ordered to get a psychiatric exam to try to deter them from really pressing any further on this. That was the first thing that would happen. They'd be ordered to get a psychiatric because they'd seen an alien or Yeah. Because they wanted to file a report. They wanted to file a report about, you know, an an UFO encounter.

uh that uh that he was the actual commander that filed the report with about it all. Uh, and then they said, "Are you are you trying to file a UFO report? Is that what you're doing here?" And he said, "Yes." He said it was the most important moment of his life. He just said, "Yes, I am." He said, "I am not letting this one go." You know, cuz they shut off all They shut off 10 independent independently wired nukes, Yeah. And so he was adamant that he was going to get that filed. And the and so

would train them to do the holotropic breathing and get them calmed down and centered, right? And then he was asking them questions. Okay, now you're inside the craft. Look around and tell me what you're seeing. And he was getting them to give little reports on these totally esoteric things, you know, that nobody would really make up, you know, and and and then he would see if other people saw similar stuff, you know, and he was verifying. And so he started got to the point where he said, "Wait a second. There's there's something really happening here with these people." And

so he called his mother so she didn't die in child birth. So he called her uh and she said, "Oh, you ought to you ought to check with uh uh with uh uh uh Bud H the Hopkins kid. You know that he's into this stuff, you know, even though he's a sculptor and artist and all that kind of stuff, but you know that uh our families are close and you ought to he's knows a lot about this." And so that's how it happened is he ended up talking to Bud Hopkins and

Hopkins said, "Oh, look, let me show you." you know, and he started giving him a lot more people. And so, by by the time he contacted me, you know, he he'd interviewed like a hundred people. You know, uh, who'd had these experiences and so that, uh, and and so he ended up calling me and, uh, when he got confronted by this faculty committee and called me and asked me if I would legally represent him. Uh and so I went there to and confronted the the the faculty committee, you know, and but

you mentioned that his friend had an experience. That's interesting. Whitley was the prince of Likenstein. Hans Adams, whoever it was, that's all I He's apparently extremely interested in It was his best friend. I think he thinks that Jesus is going to come down on a saucer or something. It's like some esqueological worldview. I don't I didn't know he and he he gathered the guy named John Brandenberg who I interviewed said that uh Prince Hans Adams um had uh gathered

an experience of one of the guys that I knew you know the the son of uh uh Bill you know Mark Goodson and Bill Toddman Mark Goodson and Bill Toddman were the guys that used to produce I Love Lucy and the $64,000 question and name that tune. all those kind of quizzy shows kind of things back in the 50s and made millions, you know, and uh and uh I was out I was out at the we were we were uh Mason Newfeld and Bob Ramy had contacted me, the guy that do

all the Tom Clansancy movies and they wanted to do the Iran Contra movie and so they they contacted me to talk with him down in down in LA and I was down in the office with Bob Remy the who's the president of the Academy of Arts and Science. He was the head of the Oscars thing, you know, and uh so we were talking with him and his his uh executive his exec uh uh uh his name um

I forgot his name wrong but anyway that that he contacts me uh and and said uh he said look there's a friend of mine that wants to talk to you, you know, would you he told me not to say who he is, but would you trust me to to uh take you there to him. So I said, "Okay, we'll do that." So So we went out and uh what's the guy's name? I think we go out get into his big red Cadillac convertible and we drive off into uh Warner Brothers and we go over to the

Warner Brothers lot and we go in and it turns out that it's Bill Toddman's son of Mark Goodson and Bill Toddman. So, here's his son who's now a a an exec in at Warner Brothers, you know, and uh and he wanted to tell me about an experience that he had had and that he had uh he was uh in college and he was on summer break and he was in the Tetons outside a boulder uh and he was climbing in the Tetons and he came up into this meadow and there was a UFO just sitting right

hovering right there in the meadow and he walked all the way over to and and put his hand on it, he said. And it was like alive, he said, "This is alive, this thing, you know, and then the whole thing started kind of shuddering and and raised up. So, he backed away from it and it just went went shot away." And he he wouldn't he didn't dare tell anybody cuz he thought that it would ruin his whole reputation and stuff in the industry. Um but uh it turns out that he said that his father Mark Goodson uh senior or Bill Toddman senior

uh was uh best friends with uh uh he's this big famous uh author that writes these romance novels anyway that uh uh and and he wrote he wrote a book about it uh partly because Bill Toddman Jr. told him that he'd had this experience. He wrote a thing called the Doomsday. The Doomsday uh Doomsday Plan or something. Who's the author? Um Sydney

his name was and he wrote like 50 of these, you know, books, you know, made millions of dollars. He too wouldn't dare ever be public about it. So he wrote this book called The Doomsday Project, you know, a of a of a a a saucer that had crashed uh in a tour bus over in Italy or somewhere happened to be driving by when they were doing a recovery of it. And so this young lieutenant colonel uh in the naval

intelligence was assigned to find out where all the people were that were on the bus that saw this because they uh just wanted to explain to them that this was just an experimental uh thing, you know, so that they wouldn't be distressed. Well, it turns out they all started getting killed, all these witnesses and uh and and so Cydney Sheldon wrote this book. It's complete fiction about it. And that's the only time he ever said anything about it and then went right back to his normal life. Wow. And so uh so Bill Toddman Jr. wanted me

to know about this just to tell me. And so I've been constantly trying to get him over the years. Said why don't you got more money than the pope you know now from your inheritance. Why don't you he still hasn't agreed to do anything. Well, you've done it for him now. yeah, Bill because he was perfectly honest about it. I didn't have any doubt that it was true. Sure. Yeah. he's a real nice guy. But it's hasn't done anything. Danny, it's exciting times right now. Do you have a prediction for the next uh 3

and was sort of, you know, I think encountered a bunch of obstacles as a result of his involvement. Yeah. Yeah. So, so the bottom line is they're going to they're going to the Senate is going to pass the the 64page bill again, probably around the middle of July between July 15th, 20th or so that they'll they'll pass it and they'll send it on over to the House. You know, we're we're focusing on Crenshaw. Crenshaw, you know, Dan Krenshaw is now the new head of the intelligence committee in the House, and that's where

we ran into trouble. before it was primarily Mike Turner who was the the uh congressman from Ohio right part Wright Patterson uh district you know was was stopping the the full bill from being pass is Cshaw pro- UFO we don't know yet we're we're trying to get but he's he's uh he's certainly not uh anywhere near as bad as Turner was you know Turner had his own personal agenda because of his constituency there

you know with with the base. But but Krenshaw's a guy that's, you know, been critical of things he doesn't agree with. He's he's kind of a bit of a maverick. Uh and he's got a lot of integrity, you know, tough guy, you know, it's a is a SEAL team dude, you know, but uh but Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But but he's not he's not just kind of a knee-jerk reactionary. Yeah. You know, so he's there's real promise there. And so we're going to be meeting with him and his staff to try to get him to see if he can

give a a leadership in the intelligence committee to greenlight the the full bill, you know, or at least a lot more of it. We've gotten 23 pages of the 64 passed with unfortunate some amendments even of that part. Y but but the bottom line what we're after is the appointment of the board that we we want to get that portion of the 64page bill done at least this time around is to get the get the the the panel uh appointed you know now one of

the challenges is that well our new paradigm institute is one of the groups that's authorized to to make uh under the statute uh but the president is the one ultimately deciding is who's going to who he's going to appoint. The Congress can mandate that he do it. They can pass the statute and say the president is to appoint this board, you know, uh but then he could, you know, he could appoint his daughter, you know, to be on it or whatever he wants to do. And so we're we're going to

try to appoint we're trying to recommend a group that is that is sort of almost uh beyond criticism. you know, the kind of pe the kind of people you'd really want to have there. Uh, and then hope that will cause Trump to say, "Okay, good. That's a good group. Let's have them do it." Uh, so we're hoping this year or at least this side of the next election, this side of the election in to get uh an additional chunk of the

64page bill passed, specifically the part having to do with the with the board. Okay. And uh we're going to have, you know, it's going to be a dynamic going on with this board. There going to be a lot of people inside the national security infrastructure that are going to want to have people in there that are going to continue to keep it as sphinctered as possible. Uh you know, uh and then there's going to be lots of people putting pressure on us to try to have it be, you know, here, let's have it all, you know, like like uh Bett, you

know, let's just order the president to reveal everything right now. just dump it on everybody, you know, that's so there there they're there extremes all around us here, but what we're trying to do is kind of navigate our way through to to really the the dynamic that's going to take place hopefully uh between now and November of 2026, you know, uh now we've got the we've got the uh end of September coming here in 2025 when that's the extension that the the uh

National Archives has given to the military services and the intelligence community to to gather together all the information they've got. Okay. And that that that's in that's a standing order that they've got. You know, it still got that wiggle language in there saying and they're to turn it over to the National Archives as soon as possible. You know, the the Senate bill said immediately and they gave them the drop dead date of October 20th. You know, and now they've managed to get the House to water it

down. to say as soon as possible. So my sense is their lawyers are going to push back against us. But uh so I'm not I'm not I I don't give it more than a 51% chance, you know, that we're going to get any kind of meaningful release of that information. Yeah. At the end of September here. Well, Danny, you're doing the Lord's work and uh Godspeed. I'm excited to see what what happens uh in the next few months and years and uh you're you're you're a really important champion for this whole topic and I hope that uh you

know as as much as I love you know my own podcast I hope that you go on like Tucker Carlson or Joe Rogan or something and the JF the JFK thing is so important and I know both are so interested in it and I I you know I I dabble and like I you know I've I've learned you know from Oliver Stone and you know read uh you know Mark Lane and and Jim Mars and all these guys and like I think you're the best living um reteller of the entire

story in a way that is a coherent narrative with all the players but you also talk about motives and so I think uh it would be great if you um if that was amplified as much as No, I I'd be happy to do it. You know that you know no interview is any better than the interviewer. Uhhuh. Uh-huh. That's true. That's true. Well, I think they're both great, but I mean they more importantly than that, they have much bigger platforms than me. I mean, I I have big platform, but there's they're next level, so biggest in the world.

Yeah. They both seem to be sincerely interested, you know, and so that's the key, you know, and they're they're not particularly biased or prejudiced in any way about it. No. and and and be and because they they straddle different kind of worldviews, you know, and reach out to people that are adherence to different worldviews, it's a valuable Those both of those guys. Yeah. Well, Danny, it's an honor, man. Appreciate you taking the time. This is always awesome. Always learn so much.